#324 - Jeff Is Touched by Hand of God in NDE After 100 MPH Crash

0:00 I had intense fear and panic because we were obviously crashing. Out of my heart came the thought, oh god help, I'm going to die. From the time that they pronounced me dead was a good 45 minutes. It's determined that I was not breathing for 20 minutes. They cut my clothes and then they paddled my heart, my heart had stopped. And I could see people screaming and crying but I didn't realise that was actually my physical body because I was somewhere else. About 20 past four in the afternoon by half past seven I was dead, clinically dead, four minutes. And they were crying because I was dead and I was trying to tell them no I'm not dead, I'm just fine, I'm okay. I was greeted by people I'd known in the past. I started to feel like I was surrounded by all this warm, loving, beautiful, soothing, loving energy. I'm back with God again. I just felt this all night to release like wow, I'm back. I'm back home again. Incredibly safe and felt at home. I'd come back home.

1:07 It was a very strong feeling that I've come back home. The only thing that I could feel if you could imagine absolute love and peace there wasn't anything else to be felt. And light is literally emitting from him and I could feel that that tremendous amount of love was coming through him as well. They were brighter than everybody else and I just knew who they were. I'd like to welcome everybody to round trip death and especially our special guest Jeff Welsh who is in Indiana in the United States. How are you Jeff? Real good Eric. I'm doing fine and how are you doing? I'm doing great. Up here in the mountains it is a beautiful spring day. I wish I could be there with you. I have to thank you for doing this. I just love to share the love of our Lord and your providing this opportunity so thank you very much for this Eric. Well if you don't mind we are going to jump right in. I know you had a very interesting near death experience when you were a younger man but let's go back even before that. Tell me a little bit about your life growing up that led up to this. Okay thank you Eric. I think a lot of puzzle pieces in my life that eventually created a tapestry of which I realized now. But I was as young as three years old and I understood that our family was not friendly. I mean they were all loving people but I could hear fights. I could see you know there was animosity, there was anger and I soon

2:42 learned that mom was really sweet, intelligent. She was a pre-med top of her class student and she decided to have kids so I kind of put the herc wear on the side. But she had a misdiagnosed scoliosis of the spine and an extra vertebrae and was in extreme pain. And back then in the 60s they didn't have the MRI ability that we have today so she went misdiagnosed or misdiagnosed. So they started her prescription drugs to try to eliminate the pain rather than try to fix the problem. So she quickly, I learned this after I was three years old but that's when I first started recognizing the hostility in the house. She quickly became addicted to prescription drugs. So as I was five, six, seven years old mom and dad would live together. They would be separated. We went through multiple family separations, threats of divorce that never actually happened but maybe 12 separations go throughout my teenage years. So I get to be seven years old. We're going to a church and I've written about this since and don't agree with the churches that serve alcohol and communions but this one did. And I was seven years old and I was with my mother who was sober in the morning and not sober in the afternoon. So we were having communion together and here I am seven years old. First time I had alcohol I thought I was poisoned immediately because it was so strong I never had anything like that and I realized what it was and mom had it and I just had a thought and maybe glanced up and it was a meditation or a prayer but I just thought Jesus you would not make my mother drunk. So seven years old

4:14 I didn't know how to process that but yet there I was. So we move ahead in time. My years were like that. My dad and my brother would usually leave the family house, move to another house temporarily and those two would live in one house in another city often, sometimes another state. My mother and my sister and I would live in the house that was remaining. So our household was broken into two. So I get to be high school age and mom's addictions are worse. She's added alcohol to it because the I guess not an excuse but part of the reason was the prescription drugs no longer touched the pain. So she started drinking with it. So now she's a prescription drug addict and an alcoholic. So my sister, my brother was going to med school. He eventually became a doctor. He's an emergency room doctor.

5:02 My sister was going to college to get a teaching degree and she was gone. So now it's just mom and I and this rather large farm property, I'll call it and had a real long driveway. So mom's not looking like the beauty queen she was, you know, in high school and college she almost looked and no offense to homeless people. We all have trials and tribulations in our life but you see somebody on the street that's just kind of sunken in and they look malnourished and this is my mother and she was she was beautiful, beautiful lady and top of a class. So she's getting near death. So it's my it's my senior year and I'm thinking she's not going to last any longer. Dad's saying and he's a loving guy and thought about the rest of family is but they were saying Jeff, why don't you just leave and go to college, you know, after you and you know, mom's going to do what mom's going to do and in other words, sort of give up on her but they didn't use those words. My brother was saying, yeah, I want you to come live with me and my sister is I'm going to college you can stay, you know, in that town with me. I said, no, I can't and I was a baby of the family. I said, I can't leave mom. So anyway, my senior year, it was she was getting worse and worse. I didn't think she was going to make it through the day often.

6:07 Do you mind if I just interject something here? I believe this was back in the 1970s. Yes. And unfortunately, there just weren't as many resources and help for addictions as there are today. Exactly. And we couldn't even really talk about it even though there was some clinic around to try to help people get sober. It wasn't discussed. It was still something to be hidden, swept under the rug. It's our family was they swept it under the rug. So grandmother knew that mom was getting near death. She was worried too and she'd call and say, what kind of mood is your mom in? Finally, after months, maybe years, I had to force grandma to say, you mean as she intoxicated as she drunk? Let's call it what it is. So here I was a young teenager and she knows real nervous and held her hand over her mouth, and we're doing the but nervous thing that she does. And so finally she was able to confront it. We talked openly about what it was. And so I would go to school and I would skip school because I would think, well, mom's not going to make it through the day.

7:05 You know, it's I put my finger under her nose and see if she's breathing and I'd go to school and drive my own truck and act like I was going to school and maybe just go out to breakfast or lunch and then come back and check on her again. So I was skipping school all this time. So everyone's thought it's my senior year. I'd like to just get high school over with not all about my college career. I got to see what mom's doing. So finally I decided to go back to school and check on things. No one knows flunking out skipping out. So I was in English class. While I was in English class, my English teacher walked out of the room because he saw me and kind of like, Oh, there's a guy I don't ever see. So he left and three minutes later, here comes the counselor and she was an older lady then and she they called her a bad name. I did not know her personally. So I never used that bad name, but she she was my counselor. So she saw me in the back room. She pointed at me went like this and all the kids in the high school in the classroom who he's caught. He's in trouble.

8:01 So they're on the second floor and the windows were only that big and you know, I'm about that much bigger. And I thought, is there a chance I could get out this window and not have to go through that lady at the only door, but I couldn't. So I went down there and she pulled me into her office and sat me down and forgive me if I start to cry. Holy Spirit hits me and I am thankful again. But she said, So how are you doing? I said, pretty good. And I just answered, you know, the normal answer. No, I mean, how are you doing? And I kind of thought, why is she asking this? Nobody's really cared. So this was the first time. So I'll stop that story there and say that she agreed with me and I'm deaf in one ear. And she said, Jeff, I think you're doing the right thing. I talked to your other friends.

8:48 I know you don't drink. I know you don't do drugs. You had some really excellent A grades, a B grades a couple of years ago, when the family was together and now they're not. And I can see the pattern. She said, So I want you to, I want you to continue doing what you're doing. And I want you to keep skipping school. And I thought, I have to clean my good ear and make sure I really heard that because I didn't think the counselor never ever tell me that to check on your mom. Do what you can. I know you're already talking to a minister and you're talking to the doctor lives next door. She said, But I want you to do me one favor. And so what's that? This was after hours of tears. I want you to go to the back room of the school where they were doing some remodeling head plastic over the halls and stuff. We weren't supposed to go back there. She said that we believers, I'm going to call them that rather than say what it was, have set up a room for children of parents that are addicts. And it's called I'm okay or that's what they called it. She said, No, we don't really talk about it because this is a public school. We're not going to ask if it's okay. We're just doing it. And so she said, If you would go back there, check in, call the guy, tell him you're coming. And I want you to do that once a week. Other than that, I want you to go home and call me once a day and tell me how your mother's doing. And so I thought this woman is an angel, just an absolute angel and dried my tears up and I went back behind the curtain and went into this room and I thought what's just going to be me and this counselor guy and there was 30 other students in there. So all of a sudden I thought, Okay, I'm not alone in this world.

10:20 And they were going through similar kinds of situations. And we just kind of, I know him, I know her. I thought what a blessing. We didn't talk about it. We all knew why we were there, you know, because it was a secret thing. So I went and then there's only about six more weeks left to school. The bell last day of the school year was the bell was getting ready to ring and I was a senior and this was going to be it. I was going to flunk, but it was going to be it for me and go get a GED or whatever I had to. So the bell rang and it just, it wasn't the normal three to five second bell. It seemed like it was two minutes long. I don't know if it was just in my head because I wanted it to be so it had to be my imagination in that case. So I turned the corner and go towards the light and the door that has those screen mesh things on it and I thought I'm going to walk out there and pray and just go home. And so I go around the corner and there's this lady that they called a bad name. She's standing there and she goes, Jeff, how you doing? I saw this time I have a real answer and she said, what's that? And I said, I'm okay, you know, because that was the name of the class. And so we just, we just laughed, laughed about that. Yeah. So she pulled me in her office and she said, do you think your mom and dad would come to a graduation? I said, no, they haven't talked to each other any year and a half or so. I don't think they would. She said, but you know, she didn't pass and so I'm confused at this point. I'm thinking, right. So what was the point of asking me? She said, did you hear about the car accident that killed a student? I said, I did. I don't know who the student was. I was so busy with mom. I didn't. Well, that

11:51 student was killed, you know, by a drunk driver. She said, but anyway, you didn't order a gown. So I'm just thinking out loud. She said, I'd like for you to go to the graduation. And she said, and then she pulled out a gown from underneath her desk and she put it on the desk and she slid it towards me. She says, this is the young man that died from a drunk driver. How much, how would you wear that in his honor or honor, whoever it was? I said, I will. I will. So I did ask mom and dad if they would come. They both did come and they asked the audience to be quiet. My sister's a year and a half older me a little bit rowdy. So she screamed when they called my name, but I didn't know that I didn't know the person in front of me and I didn't know the person behind me, you know, because I skipped school so much, but the graduation was over. And so I go home, Pam, my sister's name is Pam.

12:44 She went back to college. Dad went back to his house in another city. There's just me and mom on this big property with the remote driveway. She gets worse after that. And I think every day she's not going to make it. But I was at that point buying and selling cars to try to get extra money, you know, so we could go out to nice places to eat. Dad was paying all the bills. He was supporting everything and I understand dad was reserved, not giving extra money because would it go to prescription drugs and alcohol? So I understood that, but I wanted to treat mom and I occasionally go out. So I had this motorcycle and this was the day of the special event. I had this motorcycle and I had it sold by telephone and the guy was going to come by it. And I thought I'm going to take one last ride on this motorcycle out in the Wooded Hills in the beautiful Brown County Southern Indiana.

13:36 So I did. I went for a 45 minute drive, came back and I was approaching off the main street, not wearing a helmet because I wanted, I wanted to wind in my hair and the sun on my face, you know, and to be able to smell the fragrances of nature, you know, and just enjoy, enjoy the ride. Helmets were not required by law to be worn then. So I did not. It was a nice easy drive, but I was approaching my driveway. It was double wide, paid driveway that went around a lake down a small, I don't want to call it mountain because you have mountains out there. We don't have mountains here. We have real mountains here. Yes. I almost called it a mountain, but that's an insult to you. It was a big hill. How's that? It was a big hill. We have a lot of big hills in that area. So I went down this big hill and it was a ravine and it was going to come up another hill. And at that point I thought I'm going to open it up as fast as I can. So I pulled into the driveway, fast racing type street bike for the time 1981 May. The morning dew had lifted and I thought I'm just going to go as fast as I can. I had no fear. In fact, a friend of mine is a sprint car race, race car driver and he gave me a shirt that said faster and faster until the thrill of speed overcomes the fear of death. And this was my stupid mentality. Sounds like a really bad idea. It was a bad idea. Real philosophical, but not a good idea. So here I am. I opened it up and I probably got up to 100 miles an hour really fast. And then the downhill portion was coming up. So I had slowed down probably to 90, 85 miles an hour. The driveway had like a seal coating on it. It kind of made it a slick surface. It was double-walled.

15:09 And I thought I'm going to go down in this ravine and kind of skid in the back end around because it was that slick and I was going that fast. So I hit the throttle and accelerated. Now I wanted to go up this hill. I'm still on the driveway and ride a wheelie all the way from the top of the hill down to the house, which was quite a ways away. So that would have been just to see if I can make it that far, you know, likely I'd get close. So I was still doing 85 some miles an hour. Get to the top of the hill and I'm getting ready to pull the front wheel up and I see a big blue Chevrolet pickup truck right in front of me. Headed towards you, right? Towards me. Head on. I'm doing 85 miles an hour. Loose. Everything. This truck's coming towards me. So the only thing I could think of to do because at this point, you know, people talk about a life review and I don't think mine was as such because I was still okay. But I had this black and white movie in reverse order of now when I was a childhood.

16:05 I mean, it was a split second. I didn't have any split seconds. So whatever a split second equals, you know, in that timeframe, I saw this. And so I thought the only thing I had time for was to pray and I said, Lord, help me. Lord, help me. That's all I had time for. So I thought, okay, I'm going to crash. I'm likely going to die. That was already a given. So I thought there's no way to steer in more than I already was because I was already in. So I would have just slid the bike underneath the truck and got run over by the truck. If it had, I tried that move. So I thought the only thing I could do is flip the bike up with my momentum, my weight, throw it the other direction, try to go into the woods of which I would have definitely hit a tree at, let's say 80 miles an hour at that point and been hurt, but maybe not as bad as that oncoming truck. It was not going fast. My estimate it was going 25 to 30 miles an hour. It was coming over the hill, not expecting anybody on the private driveway either. So as I moved to make that move to go towards the woods, the truck driver, the blue Chevrolet truck was a 1965 model. It happened to be an old one back then in 1981. Decided to do the same thing. And I recognize now this is the truck of my, I call him my bother in law because he was always a bother, you know, rather than a brother in law. His family, his family called him a bonehead, you know, to be loving and fun. And so I called him bonehead too. But I recognize this was boneheads truck and bonehead had the same idea as I did. He was jumping to the outside to go hit the trees rather than hit me. So now we're both on the same head on course again, still

17:37 all a split second. So I thought, I'm done. I'm done. There's no other. I can't steer the truck right here. I'm right here. We're going to hit. And this is all happening in one split second. Right. Second. And so the, the, the gift of God to save me was, was the ability to think I guess, but it was, it was him saving me is what ends up happening. But I thought, okay, the only last thing I can do is push up with my hands on both the handlebars, both my feet on the pegs, jumped with my legs and try to get up and over the truck because my motorcycle was going into it. I mean, right there. Now that part makes sense. Okay. I get that. That's right. And so now I was going to just hit the truck or fly over the truck is what I thought I was going to do myself and the motorcycle was going into it. So the motorcycle does, it hits. It was a huge loud noise. And for some reason birds could not have been heard singing, but I heard birds singing and they hushed their singing at this moment.

18:33 All I could have physically heard, I'm talking about spiritually what I heard. All I could have physically heard was the crash of that motorcycle and it was loud. It was deafening, but I heard the birds go from singing to hush their singing. So I'm looking down at the motorcycle crash and motorcycles crumbling into the grill of that pickup truck, exploding parts all over loud noise. And I'm watching it, not paying any attention to what I'm doing because I'm flying up and over the truck. That's the last, I remember, of my physical memory. So what happens after this? The witnesses from the truck and I find out it's not bonehead driving his truck. It's actually my sister driving boneheads truck. They were going to a funeral of his grandfather who had passed away a couple of days before my sister was home from college to get her funeral clothes, so to speak. And that's why the truck was there. Normally it wouldn't have been there and they were leaving to go to that funeral. And I always say it looks like I was going to his funeral as well, but maybe through a private entrance.

19:32 Yeah, shortcut. The witnesses, my sister and my brother-in-law, a bother-in-law was I like to call him, said I've somersaulted two or three times over the top of the truck and back behind the truck and landed slammed onto the pavement. They could see me in the mirror. They turned around about that time, you know, because the motorcycle in the truck had finally stopped. They saw me slam to the ground. I do not recall that part because during that section where they said I hit my head on the cab of the truck, you know, because I was looking down and so I hit my head on the top of their pickup truck over their heads. At that point, I felt that the Holy Spirit, I'm going to call him God, caught me and carried me because I don't remember the somersaulting. I don't remember anything else. I remember being laid down with my body. The next thing I do remember is that at this point, I hadn't seen my brother-in-law or my sister as they described that portion. I felt my spirit set up. My body was laying flat on its back on the top of this hill, on the pavement, crashing just two truck links away. I felt my spirit set up. I felt my spirit stand up and my spirit turned around. I looked at my dead vessel of a human body and I even scolded myself at that point. I held my hands out and I said, what just happened? I don't like the word levitating, but I'm not touching

21:03 the ground. I'm not hovering. I'm just about a foot above the ground, whatever we want to call it, my spirit is. I'm looking at my body. I see my brother-in-law and my sister there at this point. They put a motorcycle seat underneath my head for comfort. There's parts scattered everywhere. I'm being pulled up while I'm looking down at my body. I'm being pulled up to about the top of the tree level. I said, Lord, I can't go. I can't go. I stopped. I'm watching this scene for a moment. It wasn't anything I said audible. When I say I'm speaking to the Lord, He already knows my thoughts. It's a spirit being relative. It's communicating without a vocal cord. My vocal cords are laying on the ground. My body was laying on the ground.

21:48 My brain was laying on the ground. I give zero credit to the brain. It's all the soul. I'm hovering at this top of the tree level and the house is in my view and then the wreck is right below me. I can see my sister running frantically, running to go tell mom and broke my heart, broke my heart because this I caused. In this situation where I go see if she's breathing daily, my sister's going to give her the news that whatever news she's going to deliver at this point. I see my sister through the roof of the house running a long way. It was a rather big house to the kitchen where mom was always loved to cook. But at least a mom was not intoxicated yet. And my sister's running and my mother turns around and says, Pam, what's going on? And Pam, mom, she's out of breath. I, she was hesitated, killed Jeff. And mom just had a ghostly look on her face at this point. Shock.

22:50 Her mouth just dropped open her jaw. Pam, what? What did you just say? Pam was shaking or body was quivering like that. She was going into shock, I believe. She's come, follow me, follow me. She was waving at mom, motioned her outside. Follow me. About that time, the good Lord pulled me forward, upward, higher. I turned to face heaven and I could see the bright light of the sun and it was not of the hot yellow sun. This was the sun, our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. I could see the light, the love. If people talk about, I've heard other stories. I don't watch many, but I have heard some that was a bright light.

23:35 They try to explain what it is. And maybe they had a different vision, but I don't, I don't think we can explain love. It wasn't light as in a brightest white. We could see that doesn't hurt your eyes. It wasn't blinding. It was inviting. It was love. It was a message of come to me, come to me. I think it's interesting that you use interchangeably the word light and love. Can you explain that? Yes, because I don't think the light is a brightness or a color. I think it's the presence of the Lord. I think he is saying, I am here. And so our vision then, because possibly we're not allowed to see him, is of light and love.

24:20 So, if it was the brightest light you've ever seen, it would be blinding, but it was not. So I felt like my father in heaven or my father on earth, either one, was just giving me the biggest warm embrace of love, a hug, if you will. So the light was of love and not of a luminant value. It was of a love value. So I see this light and I'm being pulled further and quicker. And I feel like I have an escort with me the whole time. I've mentioned that I felt like God caught me. And whether we want to call him, I don't like to get into terminology because I think we can be a little bit wrong. None of us are God. And God is God and thank God I'm not. I don't have to make these judgments. Whether it was God or the Holy Spirit that was with me, I felt like I had an escort going up. I felt the Holy Spirit with me or his presence. Let's go with that. However, we want to look at it. And it was taking me all the way up into heaven, past the clouds, past all the atmosphere and into a place I'm going to call the lobby of heaven. I've used that word for a few years now. The reason I call it a lobby is because I felt like I was walking into a big hotel where you're at the lobby and you know that there's a large portion of the hotel still behind there, but yet you're not in the large portion behind there. You're only in the lobby. So I felt like I was in heaven, in the lobby of heaven and not privileged to see the rest of it. For this, I didn't know. No. So this escort was walking me past groups of spirits

25:51 and mostly, and again, I'm going to describe white bodies, if you will. And it wasn't white. Again, it was a spiritual feeling or a knowing. So as I've met you on this podcast, if I see you next time, I would say, I know that guy. Well, some of these spirits were in groups of talking on my left and some on my right as being escorted down or deeper further into heaven. And one guy even turned around saying, Oh, look, I know him. And the other guy turned like, Oh yeah, he's kind of funny. And I thought, I recognize that spirit. It wasn't a face, you know, it was kind of like a facial likeness, but I didn't recognize a face. I recognize I know that person. Now time, time was not of the essence. Time was absence. So I don't know if I was looking at present, past or future. And to me, it doesn't matter. So I don't know if I knew this person prior, or if I'm going to know this person later. I just had no concept of time because there wasn't any time was left with my body. That second I hit that truck. That's the last time I felt the essence of time. So now I felt like I was free and there was there was no binding of time. So my escort walks me further. I'm not speaking to these guys, but I'm hearing them. And I go to this clouded veil. And I realized now I'm in front of, I'm in front of God. And so my escort goes around this veil while I'm standing there. It's kind of like approaching the judge's bench. I've never been in trouble. By the way, I don't like to tell it story by eyes. It's criminal.

27:22 Half the Bible was written in prison. So I'm not criticizing anybody. I felt like I was going to the front of a courtroom and I've done that in business ventures. And I was getting ready to plead my case. But in this case, I did not have to plead my case because it was already known that communications were already done. He knew I was concerned about my mother. I couldn't leave her. And as I was rising before I get there, if I can back up one second, the first time I hear from God is when I said, I can't leave my mother. I was turned around. And this was the first time he spoke and I am going to read my notes because I don't like to misquote it. But it says God said to me, time will heal all wounds as eternity is promised, not intended for healing here on earth, but in eternal heaven.

28:05 They will be fine. Sorrows will turn to joy in the house of the Lord. And so with that, I was comforted, no longer sad, even though I was ashamed of myself still. So I still had some shame feelings, human feelings, emotions. But I knew that I had this, this, this statement from him that he was going to take care of. Yes, they're going to be sad while they're here on earth of this horrific accident I caused. If you want to call it an accident, I put that in quotes, because it may not have been an accident at all. As I'm approached the bench, so to speak, or this clouded veil, my escort goes around behind. And I know it's God's presence there. And I feel like there's a another presence to his right, which would be my left. So the Holy Spirit, all I hear at this point in my hearing was shut off my spiritual hearing was this as he goes, I'm aware, the voice that I'm aware. And so they talking on, I'm just in awe, I guess, in peace and not bliss, because I know that there's this hearing going on. And I have no idea what's what's going to come back. But I know that my plea was already made and there it's being considered. So at this point, a hand comes from the clouded veil from the right hand side, and the two to three fingers approach my chest and touch my chest. And then the hand retracts. And I feel like it was a reset button. And this is where I hear the words, not yet, there is more work for you to do.

29:39 And with that, my escort was sliding me back in a way. It was it was a done deal. So I was happy I was going back to make amends for whatever I caused you know, all this pain and suffering on earth. So I was being retracted and it wasn't the slow and talk on my way up thing. It was I'm coming back quick. I was in in my body at this point. I felt my spirit in my lifeless vessel of a body. And at that point, I realize I'm back, but I can't move. I can't see. I can't hear. I can't talk. And I can't breathe. I'm trapped in that body.

30:25 I want you to hold that thought one second because before we get too far down the road, I want to ask a couple questions about what happened prior to this. That hand and the two fingers that came through, did you feel like that was the hand of God himself touching you? Yes. And I feel like as God does not reveal revealing self to anyone that it was the arm of Jesus Christ. That's the only the only rational thought I can have. But it was of God touching me. So was it a symbolic Jesus arm? I won't have that answer, you know, but I know that it was it was a touch from our Lord. Okay. All right, that's good. And it is very normal as I've listened to a whole bunch of these stories for people to go quickly back into their body when it's time to go. And that's what happened to you too. And your body is completely lifeless. I can't wait now to hear what happens next. How does your body get life back?

31:24 I pray to God again. And I felt like the little kid that nags his parents. I have a beautiful child, an adult child now, but I love to see a kid that goes up to the parents shirt sleeping daddy, mommy, mommy, daddy, you know, they're not quite paying attention. They nag and pull on the shirts, leaves a little bit more just cute as it can be. But I felt like that child nagging by praying to God because he had already heard my prayer. He had already returned me. I didn't know why I didn't have any life, physical life. I only had the spiritual life. I didn't know why I was trapped there. So I said, Lord, forgive me for asking me. I thank you for returning me as I requested. And I love you with all my heart. You mentioned I have an important project to do. Could it be that I could do the project better if I was mobile? If I could see, if I could breathe, if I could hear, if I could talk and if I could walk. And I remember saying, if not, Lord, I will do with what you have given me. But at that point, I felt the breath of the Lord starting from the top of my head and just engulfing my entire body. I could feel like not goose bumps. I call them God bumps. I could feel it just feeling, filling up my entire body from my head all the way past my hips into my legs. And all of a sudden, my spirit felt connected to my physical body.

32:46 So at this point, I'm not quite awake yet. I know that my brother-in-law is still pounding on my legs saying, no, no, God, no, can't be. And I can realize my mom and my sister are hugging each other, looking at my lifeless body. So I said, Lord, I'm getting up and getting up from this wreck. I was a little bit angry at that point because I was struggling and I couldn't see yet, but I had everything else about me. So I started to get up and all of a sudden my brother-in-law said, he's moving and my sister, what? And my mother, they were all just in shock now because I was moving. And he said, lay down, lay down. Bodine was my nickname. It was not a compliment. I told you, I was from Kentucky and there used to be a Beverly Hill, Billy show where the guy was big and dumb and I was just for a bowdeam. Yeah. So because I was a Jeffrey, they called me Jeff Rowan. I wasn't the brightest crown on the box. So, so it was not the, and there was not a complimentary name, but he was yelling, Bodine, Bodine. And so I started to get up and I said, I'm going to get up from this wreck. I may have even said a cuss word, which I didn't intend, but I was angry.

33:50 You know, just by myself, nothing else. And I started to get up and I muscled against him and it started to stand up. And so then he grabbed one arm and was starting to help. And then my mom or my sister, I forget which one grabbed the other one and they stood me up and I was blinking real heavy because I couldn't see. And so finally my vision was coming back at this point. It was kind of like the sun sunrise coming up over the sunset or over the horizon where it just slowly illuminates and gets brighter and brighter. And then I could see again. And so they let me go. I was kind of walking around in circles and all of a sudden they're jumping up and down with joy and just excited and can't believe what they just saw. They just witnessed a miracle. Not unlike, I might add for the people who don't know, I know that you know Eric, but Jesus raised Lazarus after he was dead for four days. So that was the longest near death out of body experience ever recorded, at least that I know of. And then Jesus also, of course, risen himself, but he also raised a young child boy and a young child girl. So this is not the first in Paul, even in two Corinthians 12, two mentions that he knew a man in Christ talking in third person likely that was out of the body and only God knoweth whether it was in the body or out of the body and was caught up in the third heaven. So this isn't new and I'm glad that you're sharing this and you know people are finding this out. But at this point, the people, my sister, my mother and my brother-in-law didn't have a clue. I didn't either. Maybe it might have

35:20 heard it, but thought it was weird stuff. So they said, sit back down. You likely have internal bleeding of some sort. You hit and they're trying to tell me about the motorcycle wreck and I knew everything about it more than what they knew because I saw, you know, other other scenes that they weren't engaged in. So I didn't want to argue with them. I didn't want to say, Hey, I just had an outer body experience. I did not explain it. This just happened. And it was too soon. You had had no time to process this at all yet. I didn't thought to how am I going to explain this to this guy that's screaming over here and these two that are crying each other. So I said, okay, let's go get another car. So we got another car because the other two were wrecked and we got in the car and I think my brother-in-law stayed there. I think my mom was driving and my sister was with me.

36:06 So we went around the wreck and I was, I remember going past it going, Oh my goodness. Thank you Lord, you know, because I could just see this motorcycle destroyed into this heavy gauge steel pickup truck that was damaged also. And so we go around and go out to long driveway the other way and head towards town where I am now. Actually, I've been gone from this town for 35 years, but I'm back in the same southern Indiana town. So we go to the hospital about 15 miles away. Real quiet. Mom was driving like a maniac. Thank God she was mostly sober because she was cutting through gas stations and everything else. They can, my son has internal bleeding. I got to get him there so that we can stop the bleeding. They're net. He looks all right. So I thought, you know, I almost died in the motorcycle crash, but I think I'm really going to die this time. I sang it onto the handles.

36:51 Oh, that's funny. That'd be bad to have two NDEs in one day from two different things. So I said, Mom, slow down. I'm all right. I'm all right. Anyway, 15 minutes later, we pull into the ER hospital and my sister runs frantic and they're carrying me in real quick. And I could, I could see people arms bandaged up, you know, but they did whatever they could at home to get to the ER. People that were really hurt and really sick. And then here I walk in and go to the nurse up there and she's what happened. And my sister said high speed motorcycle wreck. He ran into a pickup truck not wearing a helmet flipped over the truck three or four car lengths. And so the lady stopped escorting me back to the, to the doctor. Passed all these patients that were really hurt. So sort of had a guilt trip on that one. And doctors, what happened? So the nurse repeats, you know, what happened?

37:38 The doctor's looking everywhere. And where'd you hit? I thought of my hit right there. And I don't see anything. And so he's looking at my eyes, looking at my ears and checking my neck and breathing and other things. And slows down. He does another lap now that he's not in a hurry. And then the third time he says, so tell me what happened. I told him briefly that I had a high speed motorcycle probably done a hundred miles an hour, maybe 85 when I hit, they hit the top of the truck, according to what they said. And I laid there lifeless. I did not go into the story with him because again, I haven't processed it. How do I explain it to a guy? I don't. And nobody talked about it back then. No, not, not much. I don't think I ever really heard it. If I did, it was, you know, something I maybe didn't believe. He says, I'm going to leave you here for a moment and go out and speak to your family. And so I'm praying, God show me, show me what this is all about.

38:29 And thank you. And I'm sitting on the bed, you know, with a white crinkly liner on the bed and making little noises that they have in the hospital and waiting for the doctor to return and I'm in meditative prayer. And I have a photograph because we were trying to sell the property at the time and I dropped a piece of paper. This is the actual crash scene. So I would have come. So Jeff, if you could send me that, if you have a way to send me that picture, we can post that with the show notes and some other things. So people can see what you're showing me. Okay. And I think I got a photo of the photo. So I'll tell them, I know that they're not seeing this video. It's beautiful place. It's a long driveway. And then going up to that was the blind hill. So you can see their view was blind as well as mine. So we both were hitting the crest of the hill. So the doctor goes out and he comes back in, kind of folds his hands across his chest, stares at me and takes a breath and he sighs a little bit. Not just head, yes. Comes closer to me and he puts one hand on one knee, face to my face and the other hand on my other knee and he's rather close. He said, do you believe in God? And I thought, I don't have to explain anything.

39:46 This guy already knows. I said, I absolutely do. And I shake in my head, yes. And he followed up and he said, do you believe in miracles? So I had kind of a grin on my face at that point. So I thought, yeah, God's in on this. There's a connection here. And I said, yes, I do. He said, well, I've heard your story. Talk to your family. I can't find anything wrong with you. He said, so not even a scratch on your head where you hit this truck, it knocked you out and sent you flying over the truck. He said, so seeing no injuries, I'm going to send you on your journey. And he used the word journey. I just love that man.

40:28 I wish I knew who he was. I wish I spoke to him later. But this is again, something I didn't talk about, you know, too much to, except for the people that heard about it. You know, then. So we went, got back into car, we're leaving no bill. He didn't bill us for anything, which was nice as well. Another miracle. Yes. That's the bigger miracle. I don't want to say that, but that's where I was headed. And so we got back in the car is real subdued. It was very quiet and we were all just, you know, thankful and mom kind of looks over as we're going back into normal speed. She's not driving reckless now because we have the good news that we couldn't detect any internal bleeding. Anybody hungry?

41:10 I said, no, you know, because I was just still thankful, still praying, still loving God, still embracing him, you know, and what that gift he gave me. My sister said, no, she's she's not either. And so we didn't talk about it much. Okay. So life returns back to normal. If there is such a thing never was in my life, normal. There's always a normal abnormality in our life, but mom goes back to her pattern of drinking not long after that. And so I get more worried. And at this point I've graduated. I've had this wreck. And so I think she's going to die. I think it's whether she knew it or not. It was a suicide mission. I don't know if it was her intent, but that's what was going to happen. Wasn't going to be her killing herself necessarily, but an overdose would have been called maybe accidental, but that's there was there was no recourse. She was not getting better. She was getting worse.

42:10 So I held and here I am again, a blonde from Kentucky for those that can't see the image. And so I have two excuses. One I'm a blonde and the other one is I'm from Kentucky. I didn't know what the word intervention meant, but I started to hold one and it wasn't me that was holding that intervention. It was the Holy Spirit was holding that intervention through me because I was guided. I was guided the whole way. I had no clue of what to do. So the first thing I do is call the doctor across the lake actually. Oh, I won't mention his name because it's, oh, I will, I will mention his name because it's funny and he's long, long gone and graduated life. But his name was Dr. Cure C-U-R-E. Very appropriate. He was our neighbor across the lake. So I call Dr. Cure. Forgive me, family. I love you on. I love Dr. Cure. If this is not comforting to you.

42:58 He's listening right now. Yes. And so he came over and he, he spoke to her for about a half hour with me there, maybe an hour that I wasn't there. There wasn't any aha moment, you know, when he left, he did what he could. So that was part of it. So the Holy Spirit led me to call grandma. Grandma was the one that had the nervous problem. Couldn't say the word drunk for years. And I call her and she's extremely sad. I go pick her up. I physically bring her there. I had to hide all the alcohol and drugs I could find for these four or five days. And I am certain I did not find a hundred percent of it, which is a good thing because this could have caused other physical problems of a serious health issue from all of a sudden cold turkey relapse kind of thing.

43:47 So mom seemed mostly sober and she kept asking me, where did, Jeffrey, did you find my, you know, this and that? No, I don't know, I lied. I lied because I wanted her to be somewhat sober minded for this intervention. So grandma shows up and grandma, it was, it was torturous to both of us for me to watch grandma, for grandma to see mom in this sunken face, weathered look of death. She was white, grayish color. She was not going to make it long. And for me to watch my grandmother is just very sad to tell the story now because grandmother came from a abusive marriage of where her husband was an alcoholic and abused both her and my mother. So my mother starts with this pattern, you know, as a child and was not a drunk until dismiss diagnosis of her spine. So they defeated it once and it's back to haunt him again. So grandma talks to her for a long time. I called my sister in, my sister talks to her for another day. I called a minister in and I wish I could remember the name of the minister. I don't. I was friends with five or six at the time. One of them showed up and talked to her. Nothing really happened. And yet I persisted because I was being nudged.

44:58 I was being guided by the Holy Spirit to do this. The last day I invited the school counselor. And that's where the story ties into the beginning. The school counselor that sent me to that class. She talks to mom. She says Mrs. Welsh Gloria, she called her the wrong first name basis. Do you realize that your son Jeff did not graduate high school? Mom was extremely confused. What do you mean? She hesitated. I saw you. I went there. I saw him graduate. He went across the stage. She said yes, he did. Yes, he did. Jeff and I had a couple meetings and I'm going to share this with you. He did not pass. He in fact failed all of his grades for being absent most of the last several weeks, eight weeks, nine weeks, whatever the period was. So on the average, there's no way he could survive. He started off at pretty good grades and he flunked everything. He incompletes. She said I made him a report card. It's all left. And he looked at it and acknowledged it. He was willing to accept that. She said, no, I made him another report card. I slid it across my desk to him. And this one said all HPs. And I asked Jeff, do you know what that means? And Jeff answered, no. She means, she says it means honorary passing. And I am going to pass Jeff. And I had this meeting with him, gave him the gown and then therefore you came and saw the graduation. Now I have in fact made another high school diploma. I have two of them. I

46:33 have the last one, but I'd seen three of them total. The last one, she said I took the average of his good years about three or four years ago when you and your husband were together for a short period, which were A's and B's. And averaged them with D minuses. You can't average them with F's. It comes out still poorly, I guess that way. She says, and he's a well represented C student. And I will back that up 100%. In case he ever wants to go to college, you need to transcript. It doesn't say all F's or HPs. So she made this one up for me. I have that one to this date. So mom, mom is saying that I'm shocked, you know, and start crying and breaking down. And it was a hug vest at that point between the three of us. And mom is sober and is worn out and just falls asleep right after the counselor leaves. She slept for like a day and a half. Next morning she woke up, she saw me at the breakfast table and she said, I have quit drinking. I have quit taking prescription drugs.

47:29 I'm done. And from that day forward, she was sober and she remained sober for another 35 years. Now there was an occasional go out with the family. Somebody give her a glass of wine and that just scared me to death. Occasionally she tried some other pain medicines, but she didn't. She never went back to an addicted state of mind. She remained sober. So there was one miracle after another. And the sweetest one was mom being sober and graduating life and going to meet our Lord having finished well. That's a fantastic story. Do you remember the counselor's name? Yes. Would you mind telling everybody she deserves it? She does. And of course she was elderly then. And I've looked her up recently knowing that that's 40 years past, but her last name was house, Mrs. House. And that's not the name people called her, but she was Mrs. House and she was the sweetest angel I have ever met on the face of this earth. Just so sweet. She knew what I needed. So let's give credit to the Lord and the Holy Spirit again, God can hurt. But it took this lady to be brave and to do this and to make these moves for me.

48:38 So I can't say enough about her. I wish. And I did after mom got sober. So thank you for reminding me, Erica was not going there with the story. Two years later, I bought a small furniture factory in which I was grateful. I thought, you know what? This isn't about me. This is about the T H E E about God. And one of those people that helped me in that case was Mrs. House. So I got on the telephone and I called her up. She said, Mrs. House, this is Jeff and we had a nice conversation. Oh my goodness. How you doing? That's why that's that's the point of me calling. I'm doing, I'm doing okay. And so I use those words again, you know, with that I'm okay class. So she said, Well, tell me what you're doing as well. I went to college. I quit twice.

49:20 I was so far behind academically, it was too tough. I had this opportunity to buy this business. So I went and signed on the bottom line, you know, for a lot of money, debt, and it wasn't making money. I said, I was I was able to turn around me, make it successful. And now I have some three buyers that want to make an acquisition and buy the company. And I have to thank my employees, but I have to thank you first because you helped me get me to this point. So I did have that thankful conversation with her. It just was two years later and I'd love to have seen her decades later, but that wasn't a physical possibility. So it seems like the message and I won't show you a picture. I'll send it to you. I will show it to Eric, but I'll explain to viewers when I was on that crinkly white paper in the hospital. This is the image I had. And I remembered that I was a seven year old.

50:11 I was an alcoholic drink at communion at church. My mother having all those issues. And then John two came to mind of Jesus turning water to wine. Well, I have done a deep theological study on this subject and you already know in many people that strong faith and strong knowledge realize that from Hebrew to Greek to Latin, the word wine has two meanings and they're opposing. You squash a grape on the ground. It's grape juice, but from Hebrew to Greek, they called it wine. Also, when that grape juice ferments seven to 30 days later, it is called wine and it's alcoholic because it's fermented. So the word wine is for both grape juice and the word wine is for alcoholic wine. And so Jesus, given his life saving all of us from a life of sin, teaches us that he's not going to sit, a drunkard shall not inherit the kingdom of the Lord. So in no way whatsoever could I think even as a young child and through this experience that Jesus would make people drunk at a wedding or otherwise and to where they could not inherit the kingdom of the Lord. So why, why go through the crucifixion? If he's going to make people drunk, so the answer is the word has two opposing meanings. One is grape juice of wine. The other is fermented wine that's alcoholic. The Bible is very clear. If you go to Proverbs 21, it's the clearest verse of all, which states for

51:43 all of us to stay away from wine and strong drink. So God is not conflicting. And that's why I'm not a writer, but I have written and I think I may have already shared that with you if I haven't Eric, I'll send you a copy of that too. But that was my purpose. So throughout life, I've picked up all these puzzle pieces from three year old, seven year old, teenager, 19 year old, having an outer body experience, sitting in the emergency room, mom becoming sober, other drunkenness issues in my life, not between my immediate family, but extended in friends and family, buried some. I look back now as an older person in the last five years, but all these puzzle pieces and try to figure out which we can, but I try to follow God's map, his tapestry of my life. And so putting these puzzle pieces together in this tapestry has led me to sharing and writing and doing what I do today. So I can't thank you enough, Eric, for being a part of that divine plan that's still playing itself out.

52:45 Well, thank you. I appreciate it. We just have a minute left. I would love you. You have learned so much over your life and experienced so much starting with very difficult things. Can you leave our listeners with a message of hope? Give us something to take away from all this. I wrote this about five hours ago, anticipating your question. I was on a work break on my job I just started today. So I use my work break to write this and I would love to share it with you in closing, be receptive, be open, be connected to the Holy Spirit, recognize signs of life's puzzle pieces, be ready to serve a purpose once puzzle pieces from a tapestry of life is imagined, be thankful for all the life's experiences, both negative and positive for it has shaped and molded us into who we are and then in turn our focus to serve whose we are. Love and give all of our heart, soul, mind and energy to our Lord in Jesus' name. Live life and finish well. Amen. Thanks a lot, Jeff. Thank you, my friend.

54:08 Thanks again for listening and remember to share this podcast. To be notified when the next episode goes live, follow us on your podcasting app or click over to roundtripteath.com and sign up for our email newsletter. One last thing, we are continually trying to improve this podcast and we value your feedback. If you have a comment about what you like or what we can do better or a near-death experiencer that we should have on the show, send an email to ericatroundtripteath.com and that's ericwithac. Until then, I wish you everything good that you're looking for in this life and the next.