Sept. 15, 2025
Deb Dies In Car Accident at 8 Months Pregnant - Has Unusual NDE (Near Death Experience)
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Voices said, "Welcome Back, We're So Glad You're Home."
At 26 years old and eight months pregnant, psychotherapist Deborah “Deb” Hanie survived a head-on collision that triggered a profound near-death experience (NDE).
Instead of a tunnel of light, Deb describes entering “the void”—a dark, peaceful expanse filled with loving, luminous beings who told her she could stay or return because she “had a baby.”
Choosing to come back meant waking to excruciating pain and a difficult recovery, but it also opened a spiritual path: work with Stanislav Grof’s ideas, shamanic training, and hospice “journeying” with people at the end of life.
Deb shares how her son carried prenatal trauma, why the return can be harsher than the leaving, and two extraordinary deathbed stories—including her scientist father’s passing, escorted by a circle of elephants into the light.
Video Version: https://youtu.be/TM3PtxqaIl8
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WEBVTT
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From the time that they pronounced me dead was
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a good 45 minutes. They cut my clothes and then
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they paddled. My heart, my heart had stopped
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and I could see people screaming and crying but
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I didn't realize that was actually my physical
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body because I was somewhere else. The only thing
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that I could feel if you could imagine absolute
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love and peace, there wasn't anything else to
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be felt. I was greeted by people I had known
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in the past. I'm back home again. Incredibly
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safe and felt at home. Welcome, welcome to Round
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Trip Death, everybody. I'm so grateful and happy
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that everything is finally working technology
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wise. I've got Deborah Haney with me here. Deb,
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how are you? Hi, I'm good. After all the shenanigans
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of getting this going. If listeners only knew
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what we have been through for the last 45 minutes,
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trying to make technology work, but it's working
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and that's all that matters. So anyway, welcome
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to the show. Thank you. Sorry for the rough beginning.
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No worries. Learn something new every time you
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do that. Hey, I don't know if I warned you, but
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before we jump into your near death experience
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and all the other wonderful things that we're
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going to learn from you. Would you mind taking
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just one minute and letting our listeners get
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to know you so they know who Deb is? Just tell
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us a little bit about who you are. I guess I'll
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start with this. I'm a first -generation American.
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My parents were immigrants from Germany. My mom
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is gypsy. My dad is German. And in my mom's family,
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some of these spiritual things have been passed
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down from generation to generation. I have three
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grandchildren and four grandchildren. I am a,
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I guess I'm a psychotherapist, but I'm more of
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a spiritual psychotherapist. So I've worked much
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more in the spiritual realms. Gotcha. Thank you
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for that. Okay. I don't want to waste any more
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time after all this. I want to jump straight
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into it. We're going to go back to when you were
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only 26 years old. Yeah. And eight months pregnant,
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lead up to the accident. Tell me what was going
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on this day. So I had been working that day I
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had driven lived in actually in Illinois so I
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had been driving to a meeting and on my way back
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I was on the highway and There was a red truck
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that crossed across the highway To 15 year old
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boys not to their fault at all. We all make mistakes
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Took their truck from the ranch, but really didn't
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know how to drive And so came across the road.
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It was a head -on collision. I remember bits
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and pieces of it, but basically my car was accordioned.
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So I took the jaws of life and I was in a massive
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accident. Yeah. Wow. Sorry. I don't know where
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to jump into this, but you were eight months
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pregnant. So any accident is really bad. What
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kind of injuries did you have? Were you conscious?
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What happened at the hospital? So it already
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started actually at the scene and I remember
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I remember just there were miracles like there
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were small miracles. One was there was a paramedic
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who was on his way to work who was actually behind
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me which expedited the ambulance getting there
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except they still had to cut me out of the car.
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And there was a French woman who was out in her
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land who happened to be not that far away. And
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I just remember screaming and saying, I'm going
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to have this baby because I was out of my mind,
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to be quite honest. And then I sort of passed
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out. The next thing that I remember is the ambulance
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was there and I was in the ambulance. I remember
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hearing them say, as they were calling into the
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hospital, we don't know what to give her. We're
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losing her. And that's all I remember. Right.
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Before I went to the beyond. Let's talk about
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the went. What was the process like? Do you remember
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actually leaving your body or something like
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that? A lot of people look down on their body.
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Tell me how it worked for you. When I left my
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body, it was more I didn't look back. That would
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be so me. I didn't look down at my body. I looked
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the other way. And I just remember being pulled.
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Pulled into like some people will say it's a
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tunnel. There isn't really a word for it. You're
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pulled into a portal that's probably what I would
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say pulled into a portal and The next thing that
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I knew I was in Stan Groff would call the void
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So Stan Groff would say like we experience God
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in one of two ways either People going into the
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light or people going into something called the
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void where there's nothing but everything but
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it's dark And that's where I was in that space.
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And I should also say, as I was going into that,
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I also heard what I'm guessing was an angelic
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voice saying, don't worry, it's all gonna be
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okay, whatever that means. So when I got to this...
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void, this place. There were voices that were
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talking to me, very gentle. And I think what
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I remember most that will never ever leave me
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is this sense of peace that passes all understanding.
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There's absolutely no negative emotions, just
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pure love and pure peace to the point that I
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honestly did not even remember who I was. So
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these beings were saying welcome back we're so
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happy you're home isn't it beautiful here and
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isn't it wonderful here and all of those things
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and then they said the rocketing thing which
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was and you know you have a baby and I said I
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have no idea what you're talking about what are
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you talking about and they're saying well you're
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eight months pregnant if you choose to stay your
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baby, they will take your baby. Hopefully your
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baby will survive, will be raised then by your
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husband and whoever who knows down the road.
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So they were sort of like letting me know what
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the outcome was going to be. And they said, but
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you can go back if you want to. And it was, it
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was like, it truly was in that moment, sort of
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this, I don't know what to do until like, somehow
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my wits came about me and I thought, I can't
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leave my baby for someone else to raise my baby.
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And as soon as I thought that, that's when the
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spiral back down happened. The thing that I remember
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most about coming back is so harsh. Going from
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pure bliss to going to pure hell again, because
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I was in so much pain and you hit that gurney
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and I hear the paramedics say, okay, we've got
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her back now. and going, Oh my God, what decision
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did I just make? Okay. All right. Let's pick
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some of this apart. This is great. There's a
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couple things that I don't get. And so I, and
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this is not skepticism. This is you try to help
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me fill in some blanks. Okay. And one of them
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is you don't see anything. You said it was dark,
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but a being that talked to you said, isn't it
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beautiful here? How does that work? It's a great
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question. So it's dark But these beings have
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a hue to them so they have a hue of Light just
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like not like bright as a star. Does that make
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sense? Yeah, like beauty doesn't always mean
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it's visual beauty is I know a knowingness there
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it is a knowingness of where you are a sense
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of like what it feels like And I think even what
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it looks like, because now that you're saying
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that, I really do picture it. It is like being
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inside of this womb, but much greater than that.
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And everything is there, but nothing is there.
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I don't understand what that means. I know, it's
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so confusing. I've had other people tell me,
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try to explain the void before. And so with the
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little bit of frame of reference that I have,
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Maybe you can help fill in some of my blanks,
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because lots of people say everything is there
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and they feel connected to everything and everyone.
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And I think I understand that. What I don't understand
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is everything and nothing. Because you can't
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see it. Yeah. So the nothing, so we think of
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energy, we can't see energy, but we feel energy.
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Think of if we were, this is a really bad example,
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but think of if we were in a MRI machine with
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our eyes closed, we would know we were inside
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of something and sort of what that felt like
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and possibly what it looked like just by feeling
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its dimensions and things like that. But magnify
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that times a thousand. Okay. And so in this space,
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maybe we could even say, let's think of this
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as like a womb. but it's not as small as a womb.
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So everything exists within there, everything
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we would ever need, every connection to our own
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DNA, our parents' DNA, to beings that hang around
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us, to everything. And yet we're experiencing
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it in this whole different way. In fact, in the
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womb, in a way, there's the present, there's
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also the future, because you're developing into
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something. So that kind of makes sense to me.
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And even the past, right? Because our parents
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have DNA. We believe in past lives, which I do.
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We have our own soul's history, all of that.
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Okay. What else can you remember from this? You
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talked about the peace, right? Did you call it
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overwhelming peace or overwhelming love? Remind
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me. Both. Overwhelming peace, overwhelming love.
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If I could put a word to it, I would put these
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two phrases. All that matters is love and everything
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that we need is right here. Sounds like a Beatles
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song. I like it. And in that space, this welcoming
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feeling of sort of like, how did I forget this
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exists? Cause we've been here many times before.
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How did, how can, how do we keep forgetting that
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that exists? And yet we incarnate and then Come
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back to that. It's a home if you will. It's the
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ultimate home. Yeah. So I guess what I want to
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come back to is just finish explaining if there's
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more to explain and then I want to talk about
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physically what was going on with you and baby.
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So coming to this place. And I hesitate to even
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put a word to it, but for people who understand
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void versus the other, they're all the same thing.
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It's just a different experience. I think of
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the same thing. And going to that place is exactly
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like you said, like going to home that I think
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that I actually, cause when I've been with people
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who die, they say they want to go home, but they
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don't mean their house. They want to go home
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and This is the ultimate home. It is the place
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where everything is. And yet in our earth dimension,
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nothing is because it's not something we experience
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on an everyday level here on this planet in this
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dimension. Here's another way to describe it.
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It's as if I had access to anything I would want.
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When one of the beings said to me, Well, you
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have a baby I I knew I could keep asking and
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I knew that I wouldn't be forced to do anything
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I knew that I could ask anything I wanted I knew
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that I could stay as long as I wanted that it
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was this very soulful interaction between higher
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beings and My own soul because I wasn't my body
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that was there. It was my soul Did you feel like
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they were trying to talk you into going back?
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I've thought about that many times over the years
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and I don't think so. I think they wanted me
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to make the decision for my soul so they wouldn't
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leave a piece out. Now what they didn't tell
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me interestingly is how I would fare in all this.
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Should we talk about the physical side now? Maybe
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so because they did not like allude to any of
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that. Okay. That's always one of the hardest
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things about coming back. Right? You've been
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in a place with no pain peace love only good
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and then to feel that physical pain again I mean
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after all you've just been through this horrible
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accident. It sounds like the medical personnel
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I don't know. How did they revive you? Did they
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do you know did they shock you what happened?
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They had put something in my IV that Got the
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heart Whatever they would call it Like an adrenaline
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to restart it. That's a good one. Yeah, like
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an adrenaline I honestly never asked to be honest
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with you why they didn't do the shock but my
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guess is because I was eight months pregnant
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and that would have I Don't know what but with
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the adrenaline it worked Then I just remember
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I honestly don't remember much again until I
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got to the hospital and then there's just a whole
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lot of people everywhere Ended up going in an
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MRI machine because I had a broken hip and ribs
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had internal bleeding and right away because
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With a baby they get concerned about that. So
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they put the monitors on and they're checking
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all of that so Long story short and they're also
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picking glass Crazily, this is what I remember
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the most the MRI everything hurts so bad, but
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they can't give you for it and not a lot of pain
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meds, right? And so what I remember most is the
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like four nurses picking glass out of my arms
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and out of my face and from the broken glass
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of the car and that hurting so bad. And maybe
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I just focused on that because I was too afraid
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to focus on anything else. Once they got the
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monitors on and I was in intensive care, the
00:15:06.429 --> 00:15:10.870
plan was to stabilize as much as they could.
00:15:11.149 --> 00:15:15.570
and then to do surgery because I had actually
00:15:15.570 --> 00:15:19.529
gone into labor. I was given medication to slow
00:15:19.529 --> 00:15:23.570
down the labor so it could stabilize enough to
00:15:23.570 --> 00:15:26.730
do a C -section and then do any repair that they
00:15:26.730 --> 00:15:29.190
needed to do. Here's where the miracle comes
00:15:29.190 --> 00:15:33.750
that I still don't quite understand. So the doctor,
00:15:34.289 --> 00:15:37.379
the... Obstetrician and the surgeon spent the
00:15:37.379 --> 00:15:39.659
night and they were coming in like every 10 minutes
00:15:39.659 --> 00:15:42.580
and somehow I fell asleep for a while and I remember
00:15:42.580 --> 00:15:45.759
before I fell asleep I had been praying which
00:15:45.759 --> 00:15:48.600
I'm not typically a religious person I'm a spiritual
00:15:48.600 --> 00:15:51.679
person but I kept praying because I kept thinking
00:15:51.679 --> 00:15:55.600
well if I decided to come back I Needed I need
00:15:55.600 --> 00:15:57.820
to do everything I can to make sure that this
00:15:57.820 --> 00:16:00.919
baby safe and that I'm that I'm gonna be okay
00:16:00.919 --> 00:16:06.000
and I woke up to the doctor over me, screaming
00:16:06.000 --> 00:16:09.379
to the nurse to get another monitor for the pregnancy.
00:16:10.220 --> 00:16:14.440
And he puts the other one and he grabs me and
00:16:14.440 --> 00:16:16.240
looks me in the face and he's like, what did
00:16:16.240 --> 00:16:20.480
you do? Your labor has stopped. I don't know.
00:16:20.740 --> 00:16:23.840
I don't know. He said, I can't believe this because
00:16:23.840 --> 00:16:27.159
we were ready to do surgery in the morning and
00:16:27.159 --> 00:16:32.799
your labor has stopped. So we're just gonna watch
00:16:32.799 --> 00:16:35.639
you really close now. So I had been vomiting,
00:16:36.139 --> 00:16:38.080
not to be really gross, but I'd been vomiting.
00:16:39.019 --> 00:16:41.440
When you internal blade, you vomit a lot of black.
00:16:42.019 --> 00:16:45.120
So they had done another MRI to check all of
00:16:45.120 --> 00:16:47.620
that and had decided that they really didn't
00:16:47.620 --> 00:16:49.940
want to do the surgery for that and wait and
00:16:49.940 --> 00:16:55.200
see. I ended up going two days past my due date
00:16:55.200 --> 00:16:58.940
in the most miserable way, I will say that. But
00:16:58.940 --> 00:17:02.879
in the hospital, most of the time, At the very
00:17:02.879 --> 00:17:04.539
end, they would let me come home, but I would
00:17:04.539 --> 00:17:08.059
have to go to the doctor every day. And then
00:17:08.059 --> 00:17:11.440
my baby was born. Wow. How long were you in the
00:17:11.440 --> 00:17:15.259
hospital? Weeks, couple weeks. Did you have other
00:17:15.259 --> 00:17:18.240
broken bones besides what you mentioned? My hip
00:17:18.240 --> 00:17:22.299
was broken and my pelvis was cracked. As anyone
00:17:22.299 --> 00:17:25.279
who's broken their ribs before, it's so painful.
00:17:25.740 --> 00:17:29.640
And what I remember most is At that point in
00:17:29.640 --> 00:17:33.559
time, he was already head down. It was my son
00:17:33.559 --> 00:17:36.619
and he was already head down, but he would kick
00:17:36.619 --> 00:17:40.160
as he got, as he got how, as he got more, he
00:17:40.160 --> 00:17:44.099
would kick. So I sat or slapped all the time
00:17:44.099 --> 00:17:46.960
with my hand tucked under my ribs to protect
00:17:46.960 --> 00:17:49.720
my ribs because every time he kicked, oh my gosh,
00:17:49.720 --> 00:17:52.400
I just about came through the roof. I don't think
00:17:52.400 --> 00:17:54.619
I've ever talked to anyone before that's had
00:17:54.619 --> 00:17:57.259
broken ribs while they were pregnant. That's
00:17:57.259 --> 00:18:00.230
a whole. A whole new level of pain right there.
00:18:00.470 --> 00:18:05.670
Yeah, it's really painful. And was baby okay
00:18:05.670 --> 00:18:10.549
when he was born? So he was healthy. Here's what
00:18:10.549 --> 00:18:13.549
I would say. He was physically healthy. Here's
00:18:13.549 --> 00:18:16.670
what was really interesting for anyone who doesn't
00:18:16.670 --> 00:18:19.170
think that when we're in utero, we don't hold
00:18:19.170 --> 00:18:23.470
memory. That's so false. He was a baby who was
00:18:23.470 --> 00:18:28.809
very, very attached to me and he would get upset
00:18:28.809 --> 00:18:32.329
really easily. When he was a baby, and I didn't
00:18:32.329 --> 00:18:35.210
catch it right away, but when he was a baby and
00:18:35.210 --> 00:18:39.289
ambulance or sirens would go by, he would just
00:18:39.289 --> 00:18:41.829
start shaking as if he were in a trauma response.
00:18:42.829 --> 00:18:46.390
When he was two, I think I finally figured it
00:18:46.390 --> 00:18:48.869
out enough that he would, because he was constantly
00:18:48.869 --> 00:18:50.890
doing this. And then as it got older, he would
00:18:50.890 --> 00:18:53.410
hold his ears and just shake and shake and shake
00:18:53.410 --> 00:18:58.099
like he was in a trauma response. And so, I took
00:18:58.099 --> 00:19:01.680
him to an energy worker to help clear some of
00:19:01.680 --> 00:19:05.460
that because he shouldn't carry that. Wow, we
00:19:05.460 --> 00:19:07.920
don't think about those kinds of things. You
00:19:07.920 --> 00:19:11.299
talked about, I think you used the term spiraling
00:19:11.299 --> 00:19:14.099
when you came back down into your body. Explain
00:19:14.099 --> 00:19:18.180
that a little bit more. If the going to was like
00:19:18.180 --> 00:19:22.380
just gently being pulled up into this place.
00:19:22.670 --> 00:19:25.990
The coming away from it was leaving that place
00:19:25.990 --> 00:19:28.650
slowly, but then like if you're coming down a
00:19:28.650 --> 00:19:31.529
fast slide and then bam, that's what that felt
00:19:31.529 --> 00:19:36.490
like. So going from that to the gurney. And you
00:19:36.490 --> 00:19:38.910
keep smacking your hands. So was it kind of like
00:19:38.910 --> 00:19:41.990
a smack back in your body, slam in your body?
00:19:42.049 --> 00:19:44.809
How would you describe it? What I remember most
00:19:44.809 --> 00:19:48.829
is like slam back in my body and feeling that
00:19:48.829 --> 00:19:51.329
hard gurney because the gurneys and ambulances
00:19:51.640 --> 00:19:54.279
because of what was happening and how I was strapped
00:19:54.279 --> 00:19:57.180
and everything. It was a hard gurney. And I remember
00:19:57.180 --> 00:20:00.200
just feeling so uncomfortable. Tell me what you
00:20:00.200 --> 00:20:02.119
learned from all this. How did it change your
00:20:02.119 --> 00:20:06.400
life? Radically. Wow, there's so many ways it
00:20:06.400 --> 00:20:09.660
changed my life. I always speak my truth about
00:20:09.660 --> 00:20:11.940
what it was what it was like for me. I'm not
00:20:11.940 --> 00:20:14.440
saying that it's like this for I know many people
00:20:14.440 --> 00:20:16.960
have had near -death experiences and just felt
00:20:16.960 --> 00:20:19.680
glorious and all of that. For me, that was not
00:20:19.680 --> 00:20:23.029
the case. In all honesty, I had a deep depression.
00:20:23.710 --> 00:20:26.990
Having a baby and being in so much pain, it made
00:20:26.990 --> 00:20:29.670
me really go to that place of like, I don't know
00:20:29.670 --> 00:20:32.250
if I like this earth. I don't know if I like
00:20:32.250 --> 00:20:36.710
this. However, that being said, when I had my
00:20:36.710 --> 00:20:39.890
second child, we moved to Colorado. And that
00:20:39.890 --> 00:20:43.049
is truly when the magic started happening. And
00:20:43.049 --> 00:20:46.210
it all I truly believe it all came from this.
00:20:46.369 --> 00:20:48.289
I feel like the near -death experience was a
00:20:48.289 --> 00:20:51.710
part of my journey. It was supposed to be. I
00:20:51.710 --> 00:20:57.150
was fortunate enough to connect with a therapist
00:20:57.150 --> 00:21:00.230
who I was doing some trauma work around, around
00:21:00.230 --> 00:21:03.789
this accident. But panic was getting worse, not
00:21:03.789 --> 00:21:07.190
better. And she contacted someone, his name is
00:21:07.190 --> 00:21:09.690
Stanislav Grof. I'm not sure if you're familiar.
00:21:10.490 --> 00:21:15.250
He's a very brilliant psychiatrist who developed
00:21:15.250 --> 00:21:17.430
holotropic breathwork. He was doing research
00:21:17.430 --> 00:21:21.329
with Timothy Leary and that whole crowd in those
00:21:21.329 --> 00:21:24.470
days and came over from Prague. And when he developed
00:21:24.470 --> 00:21:27.529
holotropic breathwork, he would talk often about
00:21:27.529 --> 00:21:30.470
these different experiences. She was connected
00:21:30.470 --> 00:21:33.410
with him, which in turn, then I became connected
00:21:33.410 --> 00:21:37.359
with him and he told her to just keep me in this
00:21:37.359 --> 00:21:39.920
until it passed through because this would be
00:21:39.920 --> 00:21:43.099
an initiation of some sort. He said, don't worry
00:21:43.099 --> 00:21:44.920
about it. Teachers will come along the path.
00:21:44.940 --> 00:21:47.000
And I'm like, well, screw this. I don't want
00:21:47.000 --> 00:21:49.799
to be initiated into anything. I just want to
00:21:49.799 --> 00:21:52.079
feel better. But the truth is that really did
00:21:52.079 --> 00:21:57.259
happen. I got past it. I had shamanic teachers
00:21:57.259 --> 00:22:01.920
who came upon my path who then said, this is
00:22:01.920 --> 00:22:04.440
your journey. This is part of what you're needing
00:22:04.440 --> 00:22:08.759
to learn and the near -death experience was part
00:22:08.759 --> 00:22:12.240
of your initiation. So I went kicking. I did
00:22:12.240 --> 00:22:14.240
not want to do this. I said, I'm not going to
00:22:14.240 --> 00:22:18.279
do that work. That's not who I am. We can sometimes
00:22:18.279 --> 00:22:20.539
say no all we want, but it keeps coming back
00:22:20.539 --> 00:22:24.680
in front of us, right? And so I started to learn
00:22:24.680 --> 00:22:27.680
all of that. And it was true as I studied more
00:22:27.680 --> 00:22:30.539
and learned more that there are like, and I knew
00:22:30.539 --> 00:22:34.079
none of this before. There are certain kinds
00:22:34.079 --> 00:22:36.980
of initiations that would be looked at in tribal
00:22:36.980 --> 00:22:40.460
communities that would bring people into that
00:22:40.460 --> 00:22:43.259
space. And a near -death experience was one of
00:22:43.259 --> 00:22:47.940
the prime ones. We're just about done. But before
00:22:47.940 --> 00:22:50.220
I ask the last couple of questions, was there
00:22:50.220 --> 00:22:52.779
anything else on this whole journey that you
00:22:52.779 --> 00:22:55.920
wanted to fill in for us? It's not about me,
00:22:55.920 --> 00:22:59.099
but it's about my son. Because my son who was
00:22:59.099 --> 00:23:02.230
born in this, I... sometimes think he was supposed
00:23:02.230 --> 00:23:06.130
to. He ended up spending much of his time in
00:23:06.130 --> 00:23:10.170
Nepal and India and Tibet. He now translates
00:23:10.170 --> 00:23:13.710
Sanskrit and he speaks many languages and he
00:23:13.710 --> 00:23:17.130
teaches Buddhism. And so I don't know, that's
00:23:17.130 --> 00:23:19.329
his journey and we've talked about it on and
00:23:19.329 --> 00:23:21.630
off, but I sometimes wonder if this wasn't part
00:23:21.630 --> 00:23:24.369
of his journey as well. It really sounds like
00:23:24.369 --> 00:23:28.450
it, doesn't it? Doesn't it? Yeah. Yeah. How much
00:23:28.450 --> 00:23:31.119
fear of death do you have? This is what I always
00:23:31.119 --> 00:23:34.759
say, I have no fear. And then when the time comes
00:23:34.759 --> 00:23:36.859
when you know you're gonna die, who knows, right?
00:23:37.180 --> 00:23:41.000
But I do, I get called sometimes by hospice to
00:23:41.000 --> 00:23:44.420
journey, to journey with people into their own
00:23:44.420 --> 00:23:47.940
deaths. And when you journey with people into
00:23:47.940 --> 00:23:51.400
their death, it's so beautiful to watch what
00:23:51.400 --> 00:23:54.579
their journey across is. Can I share the death
00:23:54.579 --> 00:23:58.180
of my father? Yeah. I was just going to ask for
00:23:58.180 --> 00:24:00.579
an example. So go ahead and tell us about his.
00:24:00.839 --> 00:24:03.099
There's actually two that come to my mind that
00:24:03.099 --> 00:24:07.019
were so beautiful. So when my father passed away.
00:24:08.160 --> 00:24:11.079
So think about my father. He was, he worked on
00:24:11.079 --> 00:24:13.460
Apollo. He was like an engineer. He worked on
00:24:13.460 --> 00:24:16.119
Apollo. He figured out how to bend titanium.
00:24:16.299 --> 00:24:19.400
So totally a science mind. He was not spiritual
00:24:19.400 --> 00:24:23.660
at all. When he was dying of cancer, he came
00:24:23.660 --> 00:24:28.359
to me with shock and asked me if I would help
00:24:28.359 --> 00:24:32.140
him, help him die, help him cross. I said, well,
00:24:32.160 --> 00:24:34.400
you know what that means. You know that I drum
00:24:34.400 --> 00:24:37.579
and I go in and journey. And he's like, that's
00:24:37.579 --> 00:24:40.380
what I want. And he started to cry. Oftentimes
00:24:40.380 --> 00:24:43.319
hospice gives you that three hour window, right?
00:24:43.319 --> 00:24:46.599
Where they think people, someone will pass. So
00:24:46.599 --> 00:24:49.920
my mom and my sister and I, went to him and I
00:24:49.920 --> 00:24:52.519
had all my things with me, my drum and my rattle,
00:24:52.859 --> 00:24:55.039
and I could tell that he was starting to go.
00:24:55.460 --> 00:24:58.180
So when someone journeys for someone, when they're
00:24:58.180 --> 00:25:00.660
dying, you actually go with their soul. You actually
00:25:00.660 --> 00:25:02.859
help their soul leave and you actually get to
00:25:02.859 --> 00:25:05.400
see what happens at that very beginning. It's
00:25:05.400 --> 00:25:07.859
not always like horrendous, you know, like the
00:25:07.859 --> 00:25:10.200
bad things that I went through. The first thing
00:25:10.200 --> 00:25:15.259
that happened was, and this was in a hospice
00:25:15.259 --> 00:25:18.160
facility, not a hospital. There were many people
00:25:18.160 --> 00:25:21.420
down the hall and all of that. And when he, when
00:25:21.420 --> 00:25:23.599
his breathing started to really change, then
00:25:23.599 --> 00:25:29.559
I saw a whole line of elephants come walking
00:25:29.559 --> 00:25:32.700
towards him. Or anyone listening should know
00:25:32.700 --> 00:25:34.880
that he did love elephants and I have a love
00:25:34.880 --> 00:25:37.259
of elephants too, but I've never seen them in
00:25:37.259 --> 00:25:40.240
a journey. And there was a whole row of them,
00:25:40.259 --> 00:25:43.359
I don't know, maybe 20. It came towards him and
00:25:43.359 --> 00:25:46.559
they started to circle his bed. Just circle and
00:25:46.559 --> 00:25:50.619
circle and circle and circle. And then they stopped
00:25:50.619 --> 00:25:54.000
and the biggest one took his trunk and lifted
00:25:54.000 --> 00:25:58.380
his soul onto his back, turned around and started
00:25:58.380 --> 00:26:01.799
to walk towards the light. So there there was
00:26:01.799 --> 00:26:04.599
this beautiful light of the very far away, but
00:26:04.599 --> 00:26:08.559
it was there. The second elephant behind him
00:26:08.559 --> 00:26:11.700
said, you can come to the edge, but you know,
00:26:11.700 --> 00:26:14.619
you can't cross through. Speaking to you, not
00:26:14.619 --> 00:26:20.460
him. Me. And I said, OK. So I rode on that elephant's
00:26:20.460 --> 00:26:22.259
back. And then there was a whole row behind that.
00:26:22.319 --> 00:26:25.720
We got to the edge of the light. They all stopped.
00:26:25.960 --> 00:26:28.539
And the elephant that I was on said, you have
00:26:28.539 --> 00:26:31.759
to know you have to get off now. And so I did.
00:26:31.980 --> 00:26:35.519
And only like through talking to my mom and my
00:26:35.519 --> 00:26:37.579
sister, who were right there, because I'm in
00:26:37.579 --> 00:26:40.380
a journey. As soon as I got off the elephant,
00:26:40.500 --> 00:26:44.089
the elephants walked into the light. they lined
00:26:44.089 --> 00:26:48.049
up in a straight line like looking at us it was
00:26:48.049 --> 00:26:50.849
at that moment that my dad took his last breath
00:26:50.849 --> 00:26:55.490
and at that exact moment all the elephants raised
00:26:55.490 --> 00:26:59.329
their trunks and there was this incredible bright
00:26:59.329 --> 00:27:02.529
light like it consumed everything in the room
00:27:02.529 --> 00:27:07.289
and Trumpeted to the point that and this is truth
00:27:07.289 --> 00:27:12.150
half of that hall woke up weeping Because it
00:27:12.150 --> 00:27:14.690
was nighttime. It was three in the morning Two
00:27:14.690 --> 00:27:17.170
of the nurses came running into the room wondering
00:27:17.170 --> 00:27:21.170
what was happening and they were sobbing It was
00:27:21.170 --> 00:27:24.190
so beautiful That's a beautiful story. Thank
00:27:24.190 --> 00:27:27.369
you for sharing and my father had a tortured
00:27:27.369 --> 00:27:30.509
life. So for me that that was so beautiful because
00:27:30.509 --> 00:27:34.609
he had been He had been in Siberian prison camps
00:27:34.609 --> 00:27:37.769
and you know survived quite a bit. So then I
00:27:37.769 --> 00:27:40.619
thought And I had already sat for other people,
00:27:40.640 --> 00:27:43.839
but I began to think this is what's so important
00:27:43.839 --> 00:27:46.000
for our loved ones to know, like what was it
00:27:46.000 --> 00:27:49.440
like for them. So I had gotten a call from Hospice
00:27:49.440 --> 00:27:52.119
that there was a Native American man in the Native
00:27:52.119 --> 00:27:54.059
American tradition. This is the way it would
00:27:54.059 --> 00:27:56.519
go anyway, is to drum for that person and go
00:27:56.519 --> 00:28:00.400
with them. And I happened in the time to be in
00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:03.920
Hawaii facilitating a retreat. And so Hospice
00:28:03.920 --> 00:28:05.880
called and said, we have a Native American man.
00:28:05.920 --> 00:28:08.900
He really wants you to come. journey with him.
00:28:09.099 --> 00:28:12.279
I said, I'm in Hawaii. I think this was on a
00:28:12.279 --> 00:28:15.200
Tuesday maybe or a Monday. I'm like, I can't,
00:28:15.299 --> 00:28:17.960
I won't be back until Friday, but I'll, and they
00:28:17.960 --> 00:28:20.359
said, oh, he'll never make it till Friday. He's
00:28:20.359 --> 00:28:22.960
already in a coma and he's modeling and all of
00:28:22.960 --> 00:28:26.819
that. And I said, okay, well, when I fly in,
00:28:26.839 --> 00:28:29.079
when I know that I'm landed, I'll check with
00:28:29.079 --> 00:28:33.319
you and see. So this is what's really funny.
00:28:33.700 --> 00:28:37.400
So When I got off the plane, I called immediately,
00:28:37.519 --> 00:28:42.599
I called hospice, and this man, his two daughter,
00:28:42.700 --> 00:28:45.839
his two estranged daughters, I should say, had
00:28:45.839 --> 00:28:48.180
called a priest because they wanted his last
00:28:48.180 --> 00:28:51.759
rites to be read. He sat up out of a dead coma
00:28:51.759 --> 00:28:54.619
and told the priest to get the fuck out of there.
00:28:56.220 --> 00:28:59.599
Then laid back down and went in a coma and he
00:28:59.599 --> 00:29:03.339
waited. I couldn't believe it, he waited. So
00:29:03.339 --> 00:29:05.559
I got home, I got my things, I went right over
00:29:05.559 --> 00:29:08.460
to hospice. His two estranged daughters were
00:29:08.460 --> 00:29:12.079
there, I knew nothing about this man. And he
00:29:12.079 --> 00:29:14.839
was ready to go, there's no doubt. And so I just
00:29:14.839 --> 00:29:17.680
began the journey, I began the drumming. In his
00:29:17.680 --> 00:29:20.859
particular case, when he left his body, we were
00:29:20.859 --> 00:29:24.059
on like a pathway around this beautiful lake.
00:29:24.559 --> 00:29:28.339
And there was a very old woman who came to greet
00:29:28.339 --> 00:29:31.259
him and he was just weeping. She took his hand
00:29:31.259 --> 00:29:33.279
and they began to walk around the lake going
00:29:33.279 --> 00:29:36.559
this way. And as they walked around from the
00:29:36.559 --> 00:29:39.940
side, there was a whole herd of pinto horses
00:29:39.940 --> 00:29:45.099
who had run to greet him as well. And just as
00:29:45.099 --> 00:29:47.480
that happened, he took his last breath and that
00:29:47.480 --> 00:29:51.319
was that. But I was very confused. So it's best.
00:29:51.549 --> 00:29:53.970
in my world that I not know things because then
00:29:53.970 --> 00:29:57.289
I really trust it and so I asked the daughters
00:29:57.289 --> 00:29:59.829
like what was his life story like so here's what
00:29:59.829 --> 00:30:04.529
his story was he grew up on the rez and his mother
00:30:04.529 --> 00:30:07.710
couldn't take care of him so he was sort of abandoned
00:30:07.710 --> 00:30:10.230
at a young age and the tribe sort of took care
00:30:10.230 --> 00:30:14.569
of him but then he left the tribe and guess what
00:30:14.730 --> 00:30:17.750
He lived on a small farm. He had these two children,
00:30:17.910 --> 00:30:20.490
but these two girls he sort of abandoned too.
00:30:21.190 --> 00:30:24.410
And then later in life, they sort of had a little
00:30:24.410 --> 00:30:27.029
bit of contact with each other. Guess what he
00:30:27.029 --> 00:30:31.190
did for his hobby? He raised mental horses. And
00:30:31.190 --> 00:30:33.250
then I said, well, who's this older woman? Well,
00:30:33.309 --> 00:30:36.490
it was his mother who had abandoned him. Came
00:30:36.490 --> 00:30:39.789
to get him. Came to get him. It was a beautiful
00:30:39.789 --> 00:30:43.910
story in a sense. So it's always like where I
00:30:43.910 --> 00:30:48.289
go to that no matter how we die or no matter
00:30:48.289 --> 00:30:52.609
what preceded that, we still go to these beautiful,
00:30:52.609 --> 00:30:55.089
we go home, we go to these beautiful places and
00:30:55.089 --> 00:30:58.930
how we go may be different for each person, but
00:30:58.930 --> 00:31:02.849
it's still beautiful. Deb, thanks so much for
00:31:02.849 --> 00:31:05.450
all that you do, for helping all of these people
00:31:05.450 --> 00:31:07.890
and for sharing these great stories with us today.
00:31:08.130 --> 00:31:10.980
I really appreciate it. Thank you. and hopefully
00:31:10.980 --> 00:31:13.700
it will help someone else. That's the whole idea.
00:31:13.859 --> 00:31:16.160
That's what this show is all about. Yeah. Is
00:31:16.160 --> 00:31:18.460
we're just delivering a message of hope out there
00:31:18.460 --> 00:31:22.299
for everybody. Thanks again for listening and
00:31:22.299 --> 00:31:24.619
sharing this podcast. Don't forget to hit the
00:31:24.619 --> 00:31:27.420
follow or subscribe button and sign up for our
00:31:27.420 --> 00:31:30.259
newsletter at roundtripdeath .com. If you want
00:31:30.259 --> 00:31:32.819
to share your near -death experience, or if you
00:31:32.819 --> 00:31:35.180
have questions or comments about the show, send
00:31:35.180 --> 00:31:38.740
an email to eric at roundtripdeath .com. Until
00:31:38.740 --> 00:31:40.700
then, I wish you everything good that you're
00:31:40.700 --> 00:31:43.079
looking for in this life and the next.
00:00:03.749 --> 00:00:06.750
From the time that they pronounced me dead was
00:00:06.750 --> 00:00:10.210
a good 45 minutes. They cut my clothes and then
00:00:10.210 --> 00:00:13.130
they paddled. My heart, my heart had stopped
00:00:13.130 --> 00:00:16.129
and I could see people screaming and crying but
00:00:16.129 --> 00:00:18.589
I didn't realize that was actually my physical
00:00:18.589 --> 00:00:22.010
body because I was somewhere else. The only thing
00:00:22.010 --> 00:00:25.370
that I could feel if you could imagine absolute
00:00:25.370 --> 00:00:28.510
love and peace, there wasn't anything else to
00:00:28.510 --> 00:00:31.440
be felt. I was greeted by people I had known
00:00:31.440 --> 00:00:34.799
in the past. I'm back home again. Incredibly
00:00:34.799 --> 00:00:40.579
safe and felt at home. Welcome, welcome to Round
00:00:40.579 --> 00:00:43.840
Trip Death, everybody. I'm so grateful and happy
00:00:43.840 --> 00:00:47.000
that everything is finally working technology
00:00:47.000 --> 00:00:49.859
wise. I've got Deborah Haney with me here. Deb,
00:00:49.899 --> 00:00:53.380
how are you? Hi, I'm good. After all the shenanigans
00:00:53.380 --> 00:00:56.979
of getting this going. If listeners only knew
00:00:56.979 --> 00:00:59.899
what we have been through for the last 45 minutes,
00:01:00.420 --> 00:01:03.619
trying to make technology work, but it's working
00:01:03.619 --> 00:01:06.200
and that's all that matters. So anyway, welcome
00:01:06.200 --> 00:01:10.040
to the show. Thank you. Sorry for the rough beginning.
00:01:11.159 --> 00:01:13.719
No worries. Learn something new every time you
00:01:13.719 --> 00:01:16.519
do that. Hey, I don't know if I warned you, but
00:01:16.519 --> 00:01:18.980
before we jump into your near death experience
00:01:18.980 --> 00:01:21.780
and all the other wonderful things that we're
00:01:21.780 --> 00:01:23.829
going to learn from you. Would you mind taking
00:01:23.829 --> 00:01:26.209
just one minute and letting our listeners get
00:01:26.209 --> 00:01:29.250
to know you so they know who Deb is? Just tell
00:01:29.250 --> 00:01:31.489
us a little bit about who you are. I guess I'll
00:01:31.489 --> 00:01:33.969
start with this. I'm a first -generation American.
00:01:34.390 --> 00:01:37.890
My parents were immigrants from Germany. My mom
00:01:37.890 --> 00:01:42.209
is gypsy. My dad is German. And in my mom's family,
00:01:42.530 --> 00:01:45.109
some of these spiritual things have been passed
00:01:45.109 --> 00:01:49.030
down from generation to generation. I have three
00:01:49.030 --> 00:01:53.909
grandchildren and four grandchildren. I am a,
00:01:53.909 --> 00:01:56.450
I guess I'm a psychotherapist, but I'm more of
00:01:56.450 --> 00:02:00.209
a spiritual psychotherapist. So I've worked much
00:02:00.209 --> 00:02:03.310
more in the spiritual realms. Gotcha. Thank you
00:02:03.310 --> 00:02:06.209
for that. Okay. I don't want to waste any more
00:02:06.209 --> 00:02:08.909
time after all this. I want to jump straight
00:02:08.909 --> 00:02:11.870
into it. We're going to go back to when you were
00:02:11.870 --> 00:02:17.409
only 26 years old. Yeah. And eight months pregnant,
00:02:17.909 --> 00:02:19.990
lead up to the accident. Tell me what was going
00:02:19.990 --> 00:02:23.860
on this day. So I had been working that day I
00:02:23.860 --> 00:02:27.800
had driven lived in actually in Illinois so I
00:02:27.800 --> 00:02:31.460
had been driving to a meeting and on my way back
00:02:31.460 --> 00:02:36.360
I was on the highway and There was a red truck
00:02:36.360 --> 00:02:40.520
that crossed across the highway To 15 year old
00:02:40.520 --> 00:02:43.979
boys not to their fault at all. We all make mistakes
00:02:43.979 --> 00:02:47.280
Took their truck from the ranch, but really didn't
00:02:47.280 --> 00:02:50.930
know how to drive And so came across the road.
00:02:51.069 --> 00:02:54.430
It was a head -on collision. I remember bits
00:02:54.430 --> 00:02:58.349
and pieces of it, but basically my car was accordioned.
00:02:58.349 --> 00:03:02.370
So I took the jaws of life and I was in a massive
00:03:02.370 --> 00:03:07.110
accident. Yeah. Wow. Sorry. I don't know where
00:03:07.110 --> 00:03:09.669
to jump into this, but you were eight months
00:03:09.669 --> 00:03:14.680
pregnant. So any accident is really bad. What
00:03:14.680 --> 00:03:17.639
kind of injuries did you have? Were you conscious?
00:03:18.219 --> 00:03:21.759
What happened at the hospital? So it already
00:03:21.759 --> 00:03:24.860
started actually at the scene and I remember
00:03:24.860 --> 00:03:28.740
I remember just there were miracles like there
00:03:28.740 --> 00:03:32.639
were small miracles. One was there was a paramedic
00:03:32.639 --> 00:03:34.900
who was on his way to work who was actually behind
00:03:34.900 --> 00:03:39.039
me which expedited the ambulance getting there
00:03:39.039 --> 00:03:41.639
except they still had to cut me out of the car.
00:03:42.390 --> 00:03:45.650
And there was a French woman who was out in her
00:03:45.650 --> 00:03:47.789
land who happened to be not that far away. And
00:03:47.789 --> 00:03:51.210
I just remember screaming and saying, I'm going
00:03:51.210 --> 00:03:53.449
to have this baby because I was out of my mind,
00:03:53.449 --> 00:03:55.889
to be quite honest. And then I sort of passed
00:03:55.889 --> 00:03:59.550
out. The next thing that I remember is the ambulance
00:03:59.550 --> 00:04:02.469
was there and I was in the ambulance. I remember
00:04:02.469 --> 00:04:05.490
hearing them say, as they were calling into the
00:04:05.490 --> 00:04:08.949
hospital, we don't know what to give her. We're
00:04:08.949 --> 00:04:12.810
losing her. And that's all I remember. Right.
00:04:13.349 --> 00:04:16.970
Before I went to the beyond. Let's talk about
00:04:16.970 --> 00:04:21.410
the went. What was the process like? Do you remember
00:04:21.410 --> 00:04:23.990
actually leaving your body or something like
00:04:23.990 --> 00:04:26.750
that? A lot of people look down on their body.
00:04:26.750 --> 00:04:29.490
Tell me how it worked for you. When I left my
00:04:29.490 --> 00:04:33.730
body, it was more I didn't look back. That would
00:04:33.730 --> 00:04:37.350
be so me. I didn't look down at my body. I looked
00:04:37.350 --> 00:04:41.209
the other way. And I just remember being pulled.
00:04:42.230 --> 00:04:45.269
Pulled into like some people will say it's a
00:04:45.269 --> 00:04:47.870
tunnel. There isn't really a word for it. You're
00:04:47.870 --> 00:04:49.790
pulled into a portal that's probably what I would
00:04:49.790 --> 00:04:54.449
say pulled into a portal and The next thing that
00:04:54.449 --> 00:04:57.829
I knew I was in Stan Groff would call the void
00:04:57.829 --> 00:05:01.649
So Stan Groff would say like we experience God
00:05:01.649 --> 00:05:04.910
in one of two ways either People going into the
00:05:04.910 --> 00:05:07.430
light or people going into something called the
00:05:07.430 --> 00:05:09.269
void where there's nothing but everything but
00:05:09.269 --> 00:05:12.670
it's dark And that's where I was in that space.
00:05:13.810 --> 00:05:17.910
And I should also say, as I was going into that,
00:05:18.149 --> 00:05:22.209
I also heard what I'm guessing was an angelic
00:05:22.209 --> 00:05:24.490
voice saying, don't worry, it's all gonna be
00:05:24.490 --> 00:05:28.810
okay, whatever that means. So when I got to this...
00:05:29.069 --> 00:05:32.250
void, this place. There were voices that were
00:05:32.250 --> 00:05:35.250
talking to me, very gentle. And I think what
00:05:35.250 --> 00:05:38.029
I remember most that will never ever leave me
00:05:38.029 --> 00:05:43.050
is this sense of peace that passes all understanding.
00:05:43.569 --> 00:05:46.569
There's absolutely no negative emotions, just
00:05:46.569 --> 00:05:49.970
pure love and pure peace to the point that I
00:05:49.970 --> 00:05:53.889
honestly did not even remember who I was. So
00:05:53.889 --> 00:05:58.740
these beings were saying welcome back we're so
00:05:58.740 --> 00:06:02.339
happy you're home isn't it beautiful here and
00:06:02.339 --> 00:06:04.920
isn't it wonderful here and all of those things
00:06:04.920 --> 00:06:09.439
and then they said the rocketing thing which
00:06:09.439 --> 00:06:14.560
was and you know you have a baby and I said I
00:06:14.560 --> 00:06:17.240
have no idea what you're talking about what are
00:06:17.240 --> 00:06:19.939
you talking about and they're saying well you're
00:06:19.939 --> 00:06:24.139
eight months pregnant if you choose to stay your
00:06:24.139 --> 00:06:27.279
baby, they will take your baby. Hopefully your
00:06:27.279 --> 00:06:31.459
baby will survive, will be raised then by your
00:06:31.459 --> 00:06:34.180
husband and whoever who knows down the road.
00:06:34.199 --> 00:06:36.180
So they were sort of like letting me know what
00:06:36.180 --> 00:06:38.920
the outcome was going to be. And they said, but
00:06:38.920 --> 00:06:42.240
you can go back if you want to. And it was, it
00:06:42.240 --> 00:06:45.480
was like, it truly was in that moment, sort of
00:06:45.480 --> 00:06:48.939
this, I don't know what to do until like, somehow
00:06:48.939 --> 00:06:52.339
my wits came about me and I thought, I can't
00:06:52.339 --> 00:06:55.399
leave my baby for someone else to raise my baby.
00:06:56.319 --> 00:07:00.120
And as soon as I thought that, that's when the
00:07:00.120 --> 00:07:04.420
spiral back down happened. The thing that I remember
00:07:04.420 --> 00:07:08.300
most about coming back is so harsh. Going from
00:07:08.300 --> 00:07:12.079
pure bliss to going to pure hell again, because
00:07:12.079 --> 00:07:15.220
I was in so much pain and you hit that gurney
00:07:15.220 --> 00:07:17.439
and I hear the paramedics say, okay, we've got
00:07:17.439 --> 00:07:21.069
her back now. and going, Oh my God, what decision
00:07:21.069 --> 00:07:25.009
did I just make? Okay. All right. Let's pick
00:07:25.009 --> 00:07:27.810
some of this apart. This is great. There's a
00:07:27.810 --> 00:07:30.850
couple things that I don't get. And so I, and
00:07:30.850 --> 00:07:33.490
this is not skepticism. This is you try to help
00:07:33.490 --> 00:07:36.730
me fill in some blanks. Okay. And one of them
00:07:36.730 --> 00:07:39.610
is you don't see anything. You said it was dark,
00:07:39.810 --> 00:07:42.110
but a being that talked to you said, isn't it
00:07:42.110 --> 00:07:45.389
beautiful here? How does that work? It's a great
00:07:45.389 --> 00:07:50.529
question. So it's dark But these beings have
00:07:50.529 --> 00:07:57.529
a hue to them so they have a hue of Light just
00:07:57.529 --> 00:08:00.470
like not like bright as a star. Does that make
00:08:00.470 --> 00:08:04.389
sense? Yeah, like beauty doesn't always mean
00:08:04.389 --> 00:08:08.290
it's visual beauty is I know a knowingness there
00:08:08.290 --> 00:08:12.990
it is a knowingness of where you are a sense
00:08:12.990 --> 00:08:16.779
of like what it feels like And I think even what
00:08:16.779 --> 00:08:18.600
it looks like, because now that you're saying
00:08:18.600 --> 00:08:22.100
that, I really do picture it. It is like being
00:08:22.100 --> 00:08:25.620
inside of this womb, but much greater than that.
00:08:26.019 --> 00:08:29.500
And everything is there, but nothing is there.
00:08:29.980 --> 00:08:31.899
I don't understand what that means. I know, it's
00:08:31.899 --> 00:08:35.240
so confusing. I've had other people tell me,
00:08:35.600 --> 00:08:40.419
try to explain the void before. And so with the
00:08:40.419 --> 00:08:42.759
little bit of frame of reference that I have,
00:08:43.100 --> 00:08:46.200
Maybe you can help fill in some of my blanks,
00:08:46.200 --> 00:08:50.139
because lots of people say everything is there
00:08:50.139 --> 00:08:54.080
and they feel connected to everything and everyone.
00:08:54.919 --> 00:08:58.720
And I think I understand that. What I don't understand
00:08:58.720 --> 00:09:02.899
is everything and nothing. Because you can't
00:09:02.899 --> 00:09:07.779
see it. Yeah. So the nothing, so we think of
00:09:07.779 --> 00:09:11.179
energy, we can't see energy, but we feel energy.
00:09:11.450 --> 00:09:15.250
Think of if we were, this is a really bad example,
00:09:15.350 --> 00:09:19.409
but think of if we were in a MRI machine with
00:09:19.409 --> 00:09:22.210
our eyes closed, we would know we were inside
00:09:22.210 --> 00:09:24.690
of something and sort of what that felt like
00:09:24.690 --> 00:09:27.649
and possibly what it looked like just by feeling
00:09:27.649 --> 00:09:31.970
its dimensions and things like that. But magnify
00:09:31.970 --> 00:09:36.970
that times a thousand. Okay. And so in this space,
00:09:37.269 --> 00:09:39.730
maybe we could even say, let's think of this
00:09:39.730 --> 00:09:42.960
as like a womb. but it's not as small as a womb.
00:09:44.019 --> 00:09:46.360
So everything exists within there, everything
00:09:46.360 --> 00:09:51.899
we would ever need, every connection to our own
00:09:51.899 --> 00:09:56.220
DNA, our parents' DNA, to beings that hang around
00:09:56.220 --> 00:09:59.720
us, to everything. And yet we're experiencing
00:09:59.720 --> 00:10:04.220
it in this whole different way. In fact, in the
00:10:04.220 --> 00:10:07.620
womb, in a way, there's the present, there's
00:10:07.620 --> 00:10:11.419
also the future, because you're developing into
00:10:11.419 --> 00:10:13.960
something. So that kind of makes sense to me.
00:10:14.120 --> 00:10:16.899
And even the past, right? Because our parents
00:10:16.899 --> 00:10:19.899
have DNA. We believe in past lives, which I do.
00:10:19.980 --> 00:10:23.840
We have our own soul's history, all of that.
00:10:24.220 --> 00:10:28.159
Okay. What else can you remember from this? You
00:10:28.159 --> 00:10:31.519
talked about the peace, right? Did you call it
00:10:31.519 --> 00:10:33.899
overwhelming peace or overwhelming love? Remind
00:10:33.899 --> 00:10:37.759
me. Both. Overwhelming peace, overwhelming love.
00:10:38.139 --> 00:10:40.740
If I could put a word to it, I would put these
00:10:40.740 --> 00:10:44.940
two phrases. All that matters is love and everything
00:10:44.940 --> 00:10:47.620
that we need is right here. Sounds like a Beatles
00:10:47.620 --> 00:10:53.120
song. I like it. And in that space, this welcoming
00:10:53.120 --> 00:10:57.559
feeling of sort of like, how did I forget this
00:10:57.559 --> 00:11:00.759
exists? Cause we've been here many times before.
00:11:01.259 --> 00:11:03.440
How did, how can, how do we keep forgetting that
00:11:03.440 --> 00:11:07.940
that exists? And yet we incarnate and then Come
00:11:07.940 --> 00:11:11.799
back to that. It's a home if you will. It's the
00:11:11.799 --> 00:11:15.259
ultimate home. Yeah. So I guess what I want to
00:11:15.259 --> 00:11:19.539
come back to is just finish explaining if there's
00:11:19.539 --> 00:11:22.340
more to explain and then I want to talk about
00:11:22.340 --> 00:11:25.039
physically what was going on with you and baby.
00:11:25.720 --> 00:11:29.320
So coming to this place. And I hesitate to even
00:11:29.320 --> 00:11:32.559
put a word to it, but for people who understand
00:11:32.559 --> 00:11:35.740
void versus the other, they're all the same thing.
00:11:35.940 --> 00:11:37.940
It's just a different experience. I think of
00:11:37.940 --> 00:11:43.039
the same thing. And going to that place is exactly
00:11:43.039 --> 00:11:46.340
like you said, like going to home that I think
00:11:46.340 --> 00:11:49.220
that I actually, cause when I've been with people
00:11:49.220 --> 00:11:51.700
who die, they say they want to go home, but they
00:11:51.700 --> 00:11:53.980
don't mean their house. They want to go home
00:11:53.980 --> 00:11:58.000
and This is the ultimate home. It is the place
00:11:58.000 --> 00:12:03.139
where everything is. And yet in our earth dimension,
00:12:03.600 --> 00:12:07.019
nothing is because it's not something we experience
00:12:07.019 --> 00:12:10.379
on an everyday level here on this planet in this
00:12:10.379 --> 00:12:13.080
dimension. Here's another way to describe it.
00:12:13.200 --> 00:12:17.259
It's as if I had access to anything I would want.
00:12:17.659 --> 00:12:22.259
When one of the beings said to me, Well, you
00:12:22.259 --> 00:12:25.679
have a baby I I knew I could keep asking and
00:12:25.679 --> 00:12:28.740
I knew that I wouldn't be forced to do anything
00:12:28.740 --> 00:12:32.139
I knew that I could ask anything I wanted I knew
00:12:32.139 --> 00:12:35.159
that I could stay as long as I wanted that it
00:12:35.159 --> 00:12:38.720
was this very soulful interaction between higher
00:12:38.720 --> 00:12:42.740
beings and My own soul because I wasn't my body
00:12:42.740 --> 00:12:45.440
that was there. It was my soul Did you feel like
00:12:45.440 --> 00:12:47.500
they were trying to talk you into going back?
00:12:47.840 --> 00:12:50.740
I've thought about that many times over the years
00:12:50.740 --> 00:12:53.139
and I don't think so. I think they wanted me
00:12:53.139 --> 00:12:56.299
to make the decision for my soul so they wouldn't
00:12:56.299 --> 00:12:59.299
leave a piece out. Now what they didn't tell
00:12:59.299 --> 00:13:02.919
me interestingly is how I would fare in all this.
00:13:03.519 --> 00:13:06.120
Should we talk about the physical side now? Maybe
00:13:06.120 --> 00:13:10.179
so because they did not like allude to any of
00:13:10.179 --> 00:13:13.840
that. Okay. That's always one of the hardest
00:13:13.840 --> 00:13:17.500
things about coming back. Right? You've been
00:13:17.500 --> 00:13:22.360
in a place with no pain peace love only good
00:13:22.360 --> 00:13:25.639
and then to feel that physical pain again I mean
00:13:25.639 --> 00:13:27.559
after all you've just been through this horrible
00:13:27.559 --> 00:13:31.000
accident. It sounds like the medical personnel
00:13:31.000 --> 00:13:33.820
I don't know. How did they revive you? Did they
00:13:33.820 --> 00:13:36.419
do you know did they shock you what happened?
00:13:36.799 --> 00:13:42.860
They had put something in my IV that Got the
00:13:42.860 --> 00:13:46.870
heart Whatever they would call it Like an adrenaline
00:13:46.870 --> 00:13:49.230
to restart it. That's a good one. Yeah, like
00:13:49.230 --> 00:13:52.710
an adrenaline I honestly never asked to be honest
00:13:52.710 --> 00:13:54.970
with you why they didn't do the shock but my
00:13:54.970 --> 00:13:56.929
guess is because I was eight months pregnant
00:13:56.929 --> 00:14:00.669
and that would have I Don't know what but with
00:14:00.669 --> 00:14:04.710
the adrenaline it worked Then I just remember
00:14:04.710 --> 00:14:08.350
I honestly don't remember much again until I
00:14:08.350 --> 00:14:11.590
got to the hospital and then there's just a whole
00:14:11.590 --> 00:14:14.809
lot of people everywhere Ended up going in an
00:14:14.809 --> 00:14:20.009
MRI machine because I had a broken hip and ribs
00:14:20.009 --> 00:14:24.149
had internal bleeding and right away because
00:14:24.149 --> 00:14:26.929
With a baby they get concerned about that. So
00:14:26.929 --> 00:14:28.889
they put the monitors on and they're checking
00:14:28.889 --> 00:14:33.830
all of that so Long story short and they're also
00:14:33.830 --> 00:14:37.370
picking glass Crazily, this is what I remember
00:14:37.370 --> 00:14:39.950
the most the MRI everything hurts so bad, but
00:14:39.950 --> 00:14:42.769
they can't give you for it and not a lot of pain
00:14:42.769 --> 00:14:47.210
meds, right? And so what I remember most is the
00:14:47.210 --> 00:14:50.690
like four nurses picking glass out of my arms
00:14:50.690 --> 00:14:53.750
and out of my face and from the broken glass
00:14:53.750 --> 00:14:57.250
of the car and that hurting so bad. And maybe
00:14:57.250 --> 00:14:59.389
I just focused on that because I was too afraid
00:14:59.389 --> 00:15:03.570
to focus on anything else. Once they got the
00:15:03.570 --> 00:15:06.429
monitors on and I was in intensive care, the
00:15:06.429 --> 00:15:10.870
plan was to stabilize as much as they could.
00:15:11.149 --> 00:15:15.570
and then to do surgery because I had actually
00:15:15.570 --> 00:15:19.529
gone into labor. I was given medication to slow
00:15:19.529 --> 00:15:23.570
down the labor so it could stabilize enough to
00:15:23.570 --> 00:15:26.730
do a C -section and then do any repair that they
00:15:26.730 --> 00:15:29.190
needed to do. Here's where the miracle comes
00:15:29.190 --> 00:15:33.750
that I still don't quite understand. So the doctor,
00:15:34.289 --> 00:15:37.379
the... Obstetrician and the surgeon spent the
00:15:37.379 --> 00:15:39.659
night and they were coming in like every 10 minutes
00:15:39.659 --> 00:15:42.580
and somehow I fell asleep for a while and I remember
00:15:42.580 --> 00:15:45.759
before I fell asleep I had been praying which
00:15:45.759 --> 00:15:48.600
I'm not typically a religious person I'm a spiritual
00:15:48.600 --> 00:15:51.679
person but I kept praying because I kept thinking
00:15:51.679 --> 00:15:55.600
well if I decided to come back I Needed I need
00:15:55.600 --> 00:15:57.820
to do everything I can to make sure that this
00:15:57.820 --> 00:16:00.919
baby safe and that I'm that I'm gonna be okay
00:16:00.919 --> 00:16:06.000
and I woke up to the doctor over me, screaming
00:16:06.000 --> 00:16:09.379
to the nurse to get another monitor for the pregnancy.
00:16:10.220 --> 00:16:14.440
And he puts the other one and he grabs me and
00:16:14.440 --> 00:16:16.240
looks me in the face and he's like, what did
00:16:16.240 --> 00:16:20.480
you do? Your labor has stopped. I don't know.
00:16:20.740 --> 00:16:23.840
I don't know. He said, I can't believe this because
00:16:23.840 --> 00:16:27.159
we were ready to do surgery in the morning and
00:16:27.159 --> 00:16:32.799
your labor has stopped. So we're just gonna watch
00:16:32.799 --> 00:16:35.639
you really close now. So I had been vomiting,
00:16:36.139 --> 00:16:38.080
not to be really gross, but I'd been vomiting.
00:16:39.019 --> 00:16:41.440
When you internal blade, you vomit a lot of black.
00:16:42.019 --> 00:16:45.120
So they had done another MRI to check all of
00:16:45.120 --> 00:16:47.620
that and had decided that they really didn't
00:16:47.620 --> 00:16:49.940
want to do the surgery for that and wait and
00:16:49.940 --> 00:16:55.200
see. I ended up going two days past my due date
00:16:55.200 --> 00:16:58.940
in the most miserable way, I will say that. But
00:16:58.940 --> 00:17:02.879
in the hospital, most of the time, At the very
00:17:02.879 --> 00:17:04.539
end, they would let me come home, but I would
00:17:04.539 --> 00:17:08.059
have to go to the doctor every day. And then
00:17:08.059 --> 00:17:11.440
my baby was born. Wow. How long were you in the
00:17:11.440 --> 00:17:15.259
hospital? Weeks, couple weeks. Did you have other
00:17:15.259 --> 00:17:18.240
broken bones besides what you mentioned? My hip
00:17:18.240 --> 00:17:22.299
was broken and my pelvis was cracked. As anyone
00:17:22.299 --> 00:17:25.279
who's broken their ribs before, it's so painful.
00:17:25.740 --> 00:17:29.640
And what I remember most is At that point in
00:17:29.640 --> 00:17:33.559
time, he was already head down. It was my son
00:17:33.559 --> 00:17:36.619
and he was already head down, but he would kick
00:17:36.619 --> 00:17:40.160
as he got, as he got how, as he got more, he
00:17:40.160 --> 00:17:44.099
would kick. So I sat or slapped all the time
00:17:44.099 --> 00:17:46.960
with my hand tucked under my ribs to protect
00:17:46.960 --> 00:17:49.720
my ribs because every time he kicked, oh my gosh,
00:17:49.720 --> 00:17:52.400
I just about came through the roof. I don't think
00:17:52.400 --> 00:17:54.619
I've ever talked to anyone before that's had
00:17:54.619 --> 00:17:57.259
broken ribs while they were pregnant. That's
00:17:57.259 --> 00:18:00.230
a whole. A whole new level of pain right there.
00:18:00.470 --> 00:18:05.670
Yeah, it's really painful. And was baby okay
00:18:05.670 --> 00:18:10.549
when he was born? So he was healthy. Here's what
00:18:10.549 --> 00:18:13.549
I would say. He was physically healthy. Here's
00:18:13.549 --> 00:18:16.670
what was really interesting for anyone who doesn't
00:18:16.670 --> 00:18:19.170
think that when we're in utero, we don't hold
00:18:19.170 --> 00:18:23.470
memory. That's so false. He was a baby who was
00:18:23.470 --> 00:18:28.809
very, very attached to me and he would get upset
00:18:28.809 --> 00:18:32.329
really easily. When he was a baby, and I didn't
00:18:32.329 --> 00:18:35.210
catch it right away, but when he was a baby and
00:18:35.210 --> 00:18:39.289
ambulance or sirens would go by, he would just
00:18:39.289 --> 00:18:41.829
start shaking as if he were in a trauma response.
00:18:42.829 --> 00:18:46.390
When he was two, I think I finally figured it
00:18:46.390 --> 00:18:48.869
out enough that he would, because he was constantly
00:18:48.869 --> 00:18:50.890
doing this. And then as it got older, he would
00:18:50.890 --> 00:18:53.410
hold his ears and just shake and shake and shake
00:18:53.410 --> 00:18:58.099
like he was in a trauma response. And so, I took
00:18:58.099 --> 00:19:01.680
him to an energy worker to help clear some of
00:19:01.680 --> 00:19:05.460
that because he shouldn't carry that. Wow, we
00:19:05.460 --> 00:19:07.920
don't think about those kinds of things. You
00:19:07.920 --> 00:19:11.299
talked about, I think you used the term spiraling
00:19:11.299 --> 00:19:14.099
when you came back down into your body. Explain
00:19:14.099 --> 00:19:18.180
that a little bit more. If the going to was like
00:19:18.180 --> 00:19:22.380
just gently being pulled up into this place.
00:19:22.670 --> 00:19:25.990
The coming away from it was leaving that place
00:19:25.990 --> 00:19:28.650
slowly, but then like if you're coming down a
00:19:28.650 --> 00:19:31.529
fast slide and then bam, that's what that felt
00:19:31.529 --> 00:19:36.490
like. So going from that to the gurney. And you
00:19:36.490 --> 00:19:38.910
keep smacking your hands. So was it kind of like
00:19:38.910 --> 00:19:41.990
a smack back in your body, slam in your body?
00:19:42.049 --> 00:19:44.809
How would you describe it? What I remember most
00:19:44.809 --> 00:19:48.829
is like slam back in my body and feeling that
00:19:48.829 --> 00:19:51.329
hard gurney because the gurneys and ambulances
00:19:51.640 --> 00:19:54.279
because of what was happening and how I was strapped
00:19:54.279 --> 00:19:57.180
and everything. It was a hard gurney. And I remember
00:19:57.180 --> 00:20:00.200
just feeling so uncomfortable. Tell me what you
00:20:00.200 --> 00:20:02.119
learned from all this. How did it change your
00:20:02.119 --> 00:20:06.400
life? Radically. Wow, there's so many ways it
00:20:06.400 --> 00:20:09.660
changed my life. I always speak my truth about
00:20:09.660 --> 00:20:11.940
what it was what it was like for me. I'm not
00:20:11.940 --> 00:20:14.440
saying that it's like this for I know many people
00:20:14.440 --> 00:20:16.960
have had near -death experiences and just felt
00:20:16.960 --> 00:20:19.680
glorious and all of that. For me, that was not
00:20:19.680 --> 00:20:23.029
the case. In all honesty, I had a deep depression.
00:20:23.710 --> 00:20:26.990
Having a baby and being in so much pain, it made
00:20:26.990 --> 00:20:29.670
me really go to that place of like, I don't know
00:20:29.670 --> 00:20:32.250
if I like this earth. I don't know if I like
00:20:32.250 --> 00:20:36.710
this. However, that being said, when I had my
00:20:36.710 --> 00:20:39.890
second child, we moved to Colorado. And that
00:20:39.890 --> 00:20:43.049
is truly when the magic started happening. And
00:20:43.049 --> 00:20:46.210
it all I truly believe it all came from this.
00:20:46.369 --> 00:20:48.289
I feel like the near -death experience was a
00:20:48.289 --> 00:20:51.710
part of my journey. It was supposed to be. I
00:20:51.710 --> 00:20:57.150
was fortunate enough to connect with a therapist
00:20:57.150 --> 00:21:00.230
who I was doing some trauma work around, around
00:21:00.230 --> 00:21:03.789
this accident. But panic was getting worse, not
00:21:03.789 --> 00:21:07.190
better. And she contacted someone, his name is
00:21:07.190 --> 00:21:09.690
Stanislav Grof. I'm not sure if you're familiar.
00:21:10.490 --> 00:21:15.250
He's a very brilliant psychiatrist who developed
00:21:15.250 --> 00:21:17.430
holotropic breathwork. He was doing research
00:21:17.430 --> 00:21:21.329
with Timothy Leary and that whole crowd in those
00:21:21.329 --> 00:21:24.470
days and came over from Prague. And when he developed
00:21:24.470 --> 00:21:27.529
holotropic breathwork, he would talk often about
00:21:27.529 --> 00:21:30.470
these different experiences. She was connected
00:21:30.470 --> 00:21:33.410
with him, which in turn, then I became connected
00:21:33.410 --> 00:21:37.359
with him and he told her to just keep me in this
00:21:37.359 --> 00:21:39.920
until it passed through because this would be
00:21:39.920 --> 00:21:43.099
an initiation of some sort. He said, don't worry
00:21:43.099 --> 00:21:44.920
about it. Teachers will come along the path.
00:21:44.940 --> 00:21:47.000
And I'm like, well, screw this. I don't want
00:21:47.000 --> 00:21:49.799
to be initiated into anything. I just want to
00:21:49.799 --> 00:21:52.079
feel better. But the truth is that really did
00:21:52.079 --> 00:21:57.259
happen. I got past it. I had shamanic teachers
00:21:57.259 --> 00:22:01.920
who came upon my path who then said, this is
00:22:01.920 --> 00:22:04.440
your journey. This is part of what you're needing
00:22:04.440 --> 00:22:08.759
to learn and the near -death experience was part
00:22:08.759 --> 00:22:12.240
of your initiation. So I went kicking. I did
00:22:12.240 --> 00:22:14.240
not want to do this. I said, I'm not going to
00:22:14.240 --> 00:22:18.279
do that work. That's not who I am. We can sometimes
00:22:18.279 --> 00:22:20.539
say no all we want, but it keeps coming back
00:22:20.539 --> 00:22:24.680
in front of us, right? And so I started to learn
00:22:24.680 --> 00:22:27.680
all of that. And it was true as I studied more
00:22:27.680 --> 00:22:30.539
and learned more that there are like, and I knew
00:22:30.539 --> 00:22:34.079
none of this before. There are certain kinds
00:22:34.079 --> 00:22:36.980
of initiations that would be looked at in tribal
00:22:36.980 --> 00:22:40.460
communities that would bring people into that
00:22:40.460 --> 00:22:43.259
space. And a near -death experience was one of
00:22:43.259 --> 00:22:47.940
the prime ones. We're just about done. But before
00:22:47.940 --> 00:22:50.220
I ask the last couple of questions, was there
00:22:50.220 --> 00:22:52.779
anything else on this whole journey that you
00:22:52.779 --> 00:22:55.920
wanted to fill in for us? It's not about me,
00:22:55.920 --> 00:22:59.099
but it's about my son. Because my son who was
00:22:59.099 --> 00:23:02.230
born in this, I... sometimes think he was supposed
00:23:02.230 --> 00:23:06.130
to. He ended up spending much of his time in
00:23:06.130 --> 00:23:10.170
Nepal and India and Tibet. He now translates
00:23:10.170 --> 00:23:13.710
Sanskrit and he speaks many languages and he
00:23:13.710 --> 00:23:17.130
teaches Buddhism. And so I don't know, that's
00:23:17.130 --> 00:23:19.329
his journey and we've talked about it on and
00:23:19.329 --> 00:23:21.630
off, but I sometimes wonder if this wasn't part
00:23:21.630 --> 00:23:24.369
of his journey as well. It really sounds like
00:23:24.369 --> 00:23:28.450
it, doesn't it? Doesn't it? Yeah. Yeah. How much
00:23:28.450 --> 00:23:31.119
fear of death do you have? This is what I always
00:23:31.119 --> 00:23:34.759
say, I have no fear. And then when the time comes
00:23:34.759 --> 00:23:36.859
when you know you're gonna die, who knows, right?
00:23:37.180 --> 00:23:41.000
But I do, I get called sometimes by hospice to
00:23:41.000 --> 00:23:44.420
journey, to journey with people into their own
00:23:44.420 --> 00:23:47.940
deaths. And when you journey with people into
00:23:47.940 --> 00:23:51.400
their death, it's so beautiful to watch what
00:23:51.400 --> 00:23:54.579
their journey across is. Can I share the death
00:23:54.579 --> 00:23:58.180
of my father? Yeah. I was just going to ask for
00:23:58.180 --> 00:24:00.579
an example. So go ahead and tell us about his.
00:24:00.839 --> 00:24:03.099
There's actually two that come to my mind that
00:24:03.099 --> 00:24:07.019
were so beautiful. So when my father passed away.
00:24:08.160 --> 00:24:11.079
So think about my father. He was, he worked on
00:24:11.079 --> 00:24:13.460
Apollo. He was like an engineer. He worked on
00:24:13.460 --> 00:24:16.119
Apollo. He figured out how to bend titanium.
00:24:16.299 --> 00:24:19.400
So totally a science mind. He was not spiritual
00:24:19.400 --> 00:24:23.660
at all. When he was dying of cancer, he came
00:24:23.660 --> 00:24:28.359
to me with shock and asked me if I would help
00:24:28.359 --> 00:24:32.140
him, help him die, help him cross. I said, well,
00:24:32.160 --> 00:24:34.400
you know what that means. You know that I drum
00:24:34.400 --> 00:24:37.579
and I go in and journey. And he's like, that's
00:24:37.579 --> 00:24:40.380
what I want. And he started to cry. Oftentimes
00:24:40.380 --> 00:24:43.319
hospice gives you that three hour window, right?
00:24:43.319 --> 00:24:46.599
Where they think people, someone will pass. So
00:24:46.599 --> 00:24:49.920
my mom and my sister and I, went to him and I
00:24:49.920 --> 00:24:52.519
had all my things with me, my drum and my rattle,
00:24:52.859 --> 00:24:55.039
and I could tell that he was starting to go.
00:24:55.460 --> 00:24:58.180
So when someone journeys for someone, when they're
00:24:58.180 --> 00:25:00.660
dying, you actually go with their soul. You actually
00:25:00.660 --> 00:25:02.859
help their soul leave and you actually get to
00:25:02.859 --> 00:25:05.400
see what happens at that very beginning. It's
00:25:05.400 --> 00:25:07.859
not always like horrendous, you know, like the
00:25:07.859 --> 00:25:10.200
bad things that I went through. The first thing
00:25:10.200 --> 00:25:15.259
that happened was, and this was in a hospice
00:25:15.259 --> 00:25:18.160
facility, not a hospital. There were many people
00:25:18.160 --> 00:25:21.420
down the hall and all of that. And when he, when
00:25:21.420 --> 00:25:23.599
his breathing started to really change, then
00:25:23.599 --> 00:25:29.559
I saw a whole line of elephants come walking
00:25:29.559 --> 00:25:32.700
towards him. Or anyone listening should know
00:25:32.700 --> 00:25:34.880
that he did love elephants and I have a love
00:25:34.880 --> 00:25:37.259
of elephants too, but I've never seen them in
00:25:37.259 --> 00:25:40.240
a journey. And there was a whole row of them,
00:25:40.259 --> 00:25:43.359
I don't know, maybe 20. It came towards him and
00:25:43.359 --> 00:25:46.559
they started to circle his bed. Just circle and
00:25:46.559 --> 00:25:50.619
circle and circle and circle. And then they stopped
00:25:50.619 --> 00:25:54.000
and the biggest one took his trunk and lifted
00:25:54.000 --> 00:25:58.380
his soul onto his back, turned around and started
00:25:58.380 --> 00:26:01.799
to walk towards the light. So there there was
00:26:01.799 --> 00:26:04.599
this beautiful light of the very far away, but
00:26:04.599 --> 00:26:08.559
it was there. The second elephant behind him
00:26:08.559 --> 00:26:11.700
said, you can come to the edge, but you know,
00:26:11.700 --> 00:26:14.619
you can't cross through. Speaking to you, not
00:26:14.619 --> 00:26:20.460
him. Me. And I said, OK. So I rode on that elephant's
00:26:20.460 --> 00:26:22.259
back. And then there was a whole row behind that.
00:26:22.319 --> 00:26:25.720
We got to the edge of the light. They all stopped.
00:26:25.960 --> 00:26:28.539
And the elephant that I was on said, you have
00:26:28.539 --> 00:26:31.759
to know you have to get off now. And so I did.
00:26:31.980 --> 00:26:35.519
And only like through talking to my mom and my
00:26:35.519 --> 00:26:37.579
sister, who were right there, because I'm in
00:26:37.579 --> 00:26:40.380
a journey. As soon as I got off the elephant,
00:26:40.500 --> 00:26:44.089
the elephants walked into the light. they lined
00:26:44.089 --> 00:26:48.049
up in a straight line like looking at us it was
00:26:48.049 --> 00:26:50.849
at that moment that my dad took his last breath
00:26:50.849 --> 00:26:55.490
and at that exact moment all the elephants raised
00:26:55.490 --> 00:26:59.329
their trunks and there was this incredible bright
00:26:59.329 --> 00:27:02.529
light like it consumed everything in the room
00:27:02.529 --> 00:27:07.289
and Trumpeted to the point that and this is truth
00:27:07.289 --> 00:27:12.150
half of that hall woke up weeping Because it
00:27:12.150 --> 00:27:14.690
was nighttime. It was three in the morning Two
00:27:14.690 --> 00:27:17.170
of the nurses came running into the room wondering
00:27:17.170 --> 00:27:21.170
what was happening and they were sobbing It was
00:27:21.170 --> 00:27:24.190
so beautiful That's a beautiful story. Thank
00:27:24.190 --> 00:27:27.369
you for sharing and my father had a tortured
00:27:27.369 --> 00:27:30.509
life. So for me that that was so beautiful because
00:27:30.509 --> 00:27:34.609
he had been He had been in Siberian prison camps
00:27:34.609 --> 00:27:37.769
and you know survived quite a bit. So then I
00:27:37.769 --> 00:27:40.619
thought And I had already sat for other people,
00:27:40.640 --> 00:27:43.839
but I began to think this is what's so important
00:27:43.839 --> 00:27:46.000
for our loved ones to know, like what was it
00:27:46.000 --> 00:27:49.440
like for them. So I had gotten a call from Hospice
00:27:49.440 --> 00:27:52.119
that there was a Native American man in the Native
00:27:52.119 --> 00:27:54.059
American tradition. This is the way it would
00:27:54.059 --> 00:27:56.519
go anyway, is to drum for that person and go
00:27:56.519 --> 00:28:00.400
with them. And I happened in the time to be in
00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:03.920
Hawaii facilitating a retreat. And so Hospice
00:28:03.920 --> 00:28:05.880
called and said, we have a Native American man.
00:28:05.920 --> 00:28:08.900
He really wants you to come. journey with him.
00:28:09.099 --> 00:28:12.279
I said, I'm in Hawaii. I think this was on a
00:28:12.279 --> 00:28:15.200
Tuesday maybe or a Monday. I'm like, I can't,
00:28:15.299 --> 00:28:17.960
I won't be back until Friday, but I'll, and they
00:28:17.960 --> 00:28:20.359
said, oh, he'll never make it till Friday. He's
00:28:20.359 --> 00:28:22.960
already in a coma and he's modeling and all of
00:28:22.960 --> 00:28:26.819
that. And I said, okay, well, when I fly in,
00:28:26.839 --> 00:28:29.079
when I know that I'm landed, I'll check with
00:28:29.079 --> 00:28:33.319
you and see. So this is what's really funny.
00:28:33.700 --> 00:28:37.400
So When I got off the plane, I called immediately,
00:28:37.519 --> 00:28:42.599
I called hospice, and this man, his two daughter,
00:28:42.700 --> 00:28:45.839
his two estranged daughters, I should say, had
00:28:45.839 --> 00:28:48.180
called a priest because they wanted his last
00:28:48.180 --> 00:28:51.759
rites to be read. He sat up out of a dead coma
00:28:51.759 --> 00:28:54.619
and told the priest to get the fuck out of there.
00:28:56.220 --> 00:28:59.599
Then laid back down and went in a coma and he
00:28:59.599 --> 00:29:03.339
waited. I couldn't believe it, he waited. So
00:29:03.339 --> 00:29:05.559
I got home, I got my things, I went right over
00:29:05.559 --> 00:29:08.460
to hospice. His two estranged daughters were
00:29:08.460 --> 00:29:12.079
there, I knew nothing about this man. And he
00:29:12.079 --> 00:29:14.839
was ready to go, there's no doubt. And so I just
00:29:14.839 --> 00:29:17.680
began the journey, I began the drumming. In his
00:29:17.680 --> 00:29:20.859
particular case, when he left his body, we were
00:29:20.859 --> 00:29:24.059
on like a pathway around this beautiful lake.
00:29:24.559 --> 00:29:28.339
And there was a very old woman who came to greet
00:29:28.339 --> 00:29:31.259
him and he was just weeping. She took his hand
00:29:31.259 --> 00:29:33.279
and they began to walk around the lake going
00:29:33.279 --> 00:29:36.559
this way. And as they walked around from the
00:29:36.559 --> 00:29:39.940
side, there was a whole herd of pinto horses
00:29:39.940 --> 00:29:45.099
who had run to greet him as well. And just as
00:29:45.099 --> 00:29:47.480
that happened, he took his last breath and that
00:29:47.480 --> 00:29:51.319
was that. But I was very confused. So it's best.
00:29:51.549 --> 00:29:53.970
in my world that I not know things because then
00:29:53.970 --> 00:29:57.289
I really trust it and so I asked the daughters
00:29:57.289 --> 00:29:59.829
like what was his life story like so here's what
00:29:59.829 --> 00:30:04.529
his story was he grew up on the rez and his mother
00:30:04.529 --> 00:30:07.710
couldn't take care of him so he was sort of abandoned
00:30:07.710 --> 00:30:10.230
at a young age and the tribe sort of took care
00:30:10.230 --> 00:30:14.569
of him but then he left the tribe and guess what
00:30:14.730 --> 00:30:17.750
He lived on a small farm. He had these two children,
00:30:17.910 --> 00:30:20.490
but these two girls he sort of abandoned too.
00:30:21.190 --> 00:30:24.410
And then later in life, they sort of had a little
00:30:24.410 --> 00:30:27.029
bit of contact with each other. Guess what he
00:30:27.029 --> 00:30:31.190
did for his hobby? He raised mental horses. And
00:30:31.190 --> 00:30:33.250
then I said, well, who's this older woman? Well,
00:30:33.309 --> 00:30:36.490
it was his mother who had abandoned him. Came
00:30:36.490 --> 00:30:39.789
to get him. Came to get him. It was a beautiful
00:30:39.789 --> 00:30:43.910
story in a sense. So it's always like where I
00:30:43.910 --> 00:30:48.289
go to that no matter how we die or no matter
00:30:48.289 --> 00:30:52.609
what preceded that, we still go to these beautiful,
00:30:52.609 --> 00:30:55.089
we go home, we go to these beautiful places and
00:30:55.089 --> 00:30:58.930
how we go may be different for each person, but
00:30:58.930 --> 00:31:02.849
it's still beautiful. Deb, thanks so much for
00:31:02.849 --> 00:31:05.450
all that you do, for helping all of these people
00:31:05.450 --> 00:31:07.890
and for sharing these great stories with us today.
00:31:08.130 --> 00:31:10.980
I really appreciate it. Thank you. and hopefully
00:31:10.980 --> 00:31:13.700
it will help someone else. That's the whole idea.
00:31:13.859 --> 00:31:16.160
That's what this show is all about. Yeah. Is
00:31:16.160 --> 00:31:18.460
we're just delivering a message of hope out there
00:31:18.460 --> 00:31:22.299
for everybody. Thanks again for listening and
00:31:22.299 --> 00:31:24.619
sharing this podcast. Don't forget to hit the
00:31:24.619 --> 00:31:27.420
follow or subscribe button and sign up for our
00:31:27.420 --> 00:31:30.259
newsletter at roundtripdeath .com. If you want
00:31:30.259 --> 00:31:32.819
to share your near -death experience, or if you
00:31:32.819 --> 00:31:35.180
have questions or comments about the show, send
00:31:35.180 --> 00:31:38.740
an email to eric at roundtripdeath .com. Until
00:31:38.740 --> 00:31:40.700
then, I wish you everything good that you're
00:31:40.700 --> 00:31:43.079
looking for in this life and the next.
